Thursday, November 1, 2012

Fraudulent motion filed in Duke case falsely attributed to Mangum

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It has been said that people tend to believe what is true that which they want to be true. This is the case with many of the commenters to this blog site… the Nifong/Mangum detractors and ill-willers, and the Carpetbagger Jihadist agenda sympathizers and colluders. The outrageous motion filed on October 29, 2012 in the U.S. District Courthouse in Greensboro, NC, which undoubtedly was meant as a mischievous fraternity-style prank has been overwhelmingly embraced as being an authentic and true Mangum-authored legal motion by those aforementioned detractors.

A cursory glance by anyone even remotely familiar with the Duke Lacrosse case of 2006 and its aftermath would easily conclude that the claims were not even intended to be taken seriously… yet, it was stamped and entered into the Durham civil case files as though it was legitimate. Those perpetrating this hoax did so in order to ridicule and disparage Mangum, and possibly to poke fun at her for her decision to take control of her destiny and legally represent herself.

Those responsible for the fraudulent filing of the motion in a Federal Court, however, do not realize the seriousness of their actions in using the U.S. Postal Service to mail the document which contains at least two forgeries. This does not represent a harmless joke, but it is a federal crime with dire consequences to those who authored and sent the legal motion. We’re talking F.B.I. serious.

The filed Motion to Intervene, which was fraudulently designed to make it appear as though Duke Lacrosse victim/accuser Crystal Mangum wrote it, mocked the state and the North Carolina justice system. The author(s) of the document had the audacity to file such an outrageous satirical Mangum-centered piece because the state and the media has laid the groundwork for such sophomoric behavior because of its slanted and singular rulings in the Duke Lacrosse case and the criminal cases against Mangum. The prejudicial reporting on those cases by the biased mainstream media has abetted in creating a circus legal atmosphere in which it is fair game to take pock shots at former Durham District Attorney Mike Nifong and Ms. Mangum with impunity.

Considering the current case against Mangum for example, what is one to think when a medical examiner provides a fraudulent autopsy report for the purpose of charging Mangum with a crime while covering up medical malpractice on the part of Duke University Hospital staff… and when a trumped up larceny of chose in action charge is used to ratchet up the murder to first degree through use of the devious “felony-murder rule”? Along with the unjust disbarment of Mike Nifong and legal persecution of Mike Nifong, it is no wonder that the North Carolina justice system has become the laughing stock of the nation.

Although this filing was meant as malicious entertainment and was not taken serious by those well acquainted with Mangum, Nifong, the Duke Lacrosse case, and cases related to them, evidently one of Reade Seligmann’s attorneys is trying very hard to believe the motion is legit. Giving credence to the document as coming from the Duke Lacrosse victim/accuser, attorney Richard Emery suggested that Mangum is “as delusional now as she has been from the outset of this case.” This statement by Mr. Emery is itself a rush to judge the document’s veracity, and in an unprofessional and malicious way uses it to viciously malign Mangum with accusations that are not supported by fact.

Although the article that appeared in The Herald-Sun did contained an error of fact in stating that the three Duke Lacrosse defendants were exonerated, it deserves kudos for publishing the article to let the public know how low those in the anti-Nifong/Mangum camp will stoop to malign them. Even though the article did not contain a quote or comment from Mangum denying any role in that filing, Ray Gronberg has assured me that a follow-up article will give her side of this bizarre occurrence… date of publication around November 2-3, 2012.

It is rare that the mainstream media will expose the hateful and evil transgressions against Nifong and Mangum, and my hat goes off to The Herald-Sun for its news article in unveiling the false and malevolent document, which might have otherwise gone unchallenged throughout the Duke case as being a truthful part of the legal dialogue.
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LINK:   www.justice4nifong.com/legal/cgm/blink/blink110112.htm

530 comments:

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kenhyderal said...

Anonymous (Is that you Dr. Cardio- Thoracic Surgeon) @ 3:11 said: "Psychological projection or projection bias is a psychological defense mechanism where a person subconsciously denies his or her own attributes, thoughts, and emotions, which are then ascribed to the outside world, usually to other people".............. You should stick to your own Specialty because you are making a fool of yourself making Psychiatric diagnoses on those you've never examined. Wikipedia???

guiowen said...

Anonymous said...

my suggestion is that all of us ignore the backend of this jack ass, kenny. he has deep seated issues ...who gives a flying rip what this racist thinks. stay in dubai and fall in love with some woman you can push around, kenny.......'

Actually, I'm trying to figure the guy out. On the face of it he's Crystal's friend, trying to help her. Yet he's so incredibly obnoxious that, if any of us were in a position to help CGM out in any way, Kenny's behavior would just repel us. He's smug, insufferable, and just refuses to answer questions in a reasonable way. It leads me to wonder whether he really is CGM's friend; he's certainly not helping her.

According to Malek Williams (if we can believe him), Crystal doesn't consider him a friend. It leads me to wonder just what sort of relationship Kenny and Crystal had back when she was in the Navy. Is it possible he fathered her son, and abandoned her, leaving Richard Ramseier holding the bag? Did he quarrel with her when she started taking up with Ramseier?
When he first appeared on this blog, Kenny stated something like "I never said that I was acting on Crystal's behalf." He says now there's no discrepancy between this and his current claim that he's Crystal's bosom buddy. Well, I guess that just reminds me of the old saying,
"I never said that I said that I didn't say it; I only said that I didn't say that I said it."
In any case, there's no point in dealing with him; he might indeed be Crystal's bosom buddy, or he might just be a troll trying to annoy all of you.

kenhyderal said...

Guiowen said: "When he first appeared on this blog, Kenny stated something like "I never said that I was acting on Crystal's behalf." He says now there's no discrepancy between this and his current claim that he's Crystal's bosom buddy" ..... Let me clarify. I am a friend of Crystal, period and no, I am not, here, acting on her behalf. Incidently, the poster Malek Williams is lying when he states Crystal does not consider me a friend. Dr. Harr who visits Crystal in gaol can attest to that. The real obnoxious behaviour that occurs here comes from people who constantly throw out charges of racism and who make charges of mental illness in those who have an opinion different then theirs. And you, Guiowen are demonstrating obnoxious behaviour yourself, when you speculate about the paternity of Crystal's son. You and your ilk have aready hurt these innocent children enough.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

"You should stick to your own Specialty because you are making a fool of yourself making Psychiatric diagnoses on those you've never examined."

But your writings show a lot of psychopathology. I have had a bit of training in psychiatry and psychology.

Maybe you should stick to working in the desert in Dubai rather than trying to understand something which is beyond your understanding - how, when there is no evidence that a crime happened why should someone be presumed guilty of said crime. You rely on unverifiable anonymous sources to justify your belief. Is that sane? I don't think so.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

"Let me clarify. I am a friend of Crystal, period and no, I am not, here, acting on her behalf. Incidently, the poster Malek Williams is lying when he states Crystal does not consider me a friend. Dr. Harr who visits Crystal in gaol can attest to that."

You SIDNEY HARR who has tried to pass off several lies on his blog as the truth, e.g. the innocent falsely accused Lacrosse players were not exonerated when it was shown beyond a reasonable doubt that no rape happened for them to be guilty of.

"The real obnoxious behaviour that occurs here comes from people who constantly throw out charges of racism and who make charges of mental illness in those who have an opinion different then theirs."

I think now you are showing signs of paranoia.

"And you, Guiowen are demonstrating obnoxious behaviour yourself, when you speculate about the paternity of Crystal's son. You and your ilk have aready hurt these innocent children enough."

Worse than Crystal who set a fire in the dwelling place in which her children lived - while her children were present?

Anonymous said...

guiowen:

"[KENHYDERAL] might just be a troll trying to annoy all of you."

I respectfully submit KENHYDERAL is more effective in being annoyed himself that no one sane or rational buys into his unreasonable guilt presuming blatant unrepentant racism rather than in annoying others.

Anonymous said...

To my last comment I add;

It would not be remarkable that KENHYDERAL is not effective in being a troll, since he has shown himself completely inneffective in all things.

guiowen said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
guiowen said...

Kenhyderal said:
"And you, Guiowen are demonstrating obnoxious behaviour yourself, when you speculate about the paternity of Crystal's son."

I've told you before, Ken, I'm not judging you. You and Crystal were both over eighteen when you got involved, and I'm broadminded.

kenhyderal said...

Sarcasm is for cowards.

kenhyderal said...

Anonymous @ 4:53 said: "Worse than Crystal who set a fire in the dwelling place in which her children lived - while her children were present"............. Crystal has never and would never put her children in harms way. Judge Jones showed what he thought of the misdemeanor child abuse charges by sentencing her to time in custody and declaring her to be a good mother. I dare say if she had made bail on day one she would have received a sentence of one day in gaol. Burning Walker's clothes should have resulted in a charge of willful damage instead of first degree arson. Initially they charged her as well with "attempted murder". Only in North Carolina. In Canada this would have resulted in a no contact order and court ordered restitution for the clothes, by a Magistrates Court the following morning. Instead she spent 88 days in gaol at tax-payers expense. I see in your election North Carolina bucked the trend. Too bad the Democratic Party didn't capture the House of Representatives as well. That way the U.S.A. might have a chance to join the civilized nations that have universal single payer health care, guaranteed for all from, cradle to grave. And no, we don't have death panels or rationed care. We can choose our own Doctors. Our people are healthier and longer living then Americans. Sorry I'm off topic.

guiowen said...

Kenhyderal,
ve told you I'm not judging you. I really don't care whether you're the boy's father. I do find it strange that this upsets you so much.
This is not sarcasm, it's a legitimate observation. I find it strange that you can't answer and take refuge in claiming that you don't have to answer a sarcastic question.

Anonymous said...

Guiowen, seems to me Kenny's entire stance on this blog is just to play oppositional. He rarely puts forward any real conribution of substance; it's usually just copy-pasting some sort of arrogance or bragging about Canada. You would think any true friend of Mangum's would be urging her, no INSISTING that she get herself a lawyer that SHE trusts and that she RUN from and IGNORE Harr. Anybody facing a murder charge needs a damn good lawyer. Without a doubt Mangum is in very deep trouble of her own making and equally, she is totally inadequate to defend herself. The degree from NCCU is a joke. Her writing skills, and more importantly, her judgment and decision-making, reflect both poor education and gross immaturity. Kenny should be on the phone with her or writing to her and giving her references for good lawyers. He should be raising money to help with legal fees. And, it is obvious that he should be working hard, every single day, to raise bail money. No excuses. THAT is what a true friend of Mangum's would do.
He may have had an intimate relationship with Mangum. Who cares. As of now he is just wind, piss and excitement.....and certainly no friend to this very troubled woman

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

"Crystal has never and would never put her children in harms way."

So how do you explain her setting a fire in her dwelling while her children were present - an attempt to provide maternal warmth?

"Judge Jones showed what he thought of the misdemeanor child abuse charges by sentencing her to time in custody and declaring her to be a good mother."

Judge Jones might have prevented the death of Reginald Daye had he dealt appropriately with Crystal.

"I dare say if she had made bail on day one she would have received a sentence of one day in gaol."

All that means is that Crystal got a break, a break DA NIFONG did not want to give the innocent men Crystal falsely accused of raping her.

"Burning Walker's clothes should have resulted in a charge of willful damage instead of first degree arson."

Even though it resulted in calling the Durham Fire Department(which resulted in SIDNEY falsely accusing a police officer of arson, something you apparently refuse to notice) and significant smoke damage to the dwelling? I doubt a Canadian Court would have treated it merely as willful damage. How would a Canadian court have treated a case of someone willfully damaging another's reputation, which Crystal did to the innocent Lacrosse players?

"Initially they charged her as well with 'attempted murder'. Only in North Carolina."

I agree that attempted murder was excessive. Menacing or attempted assault would have been appropriate. However, the context of your statement is, you believe someone should have been charged with raping Crystal in the face of overwhelming evidence that Crystal was not raped.

"In Canada this would have resulted in a no contact order and court ordered restitution for the clothes, by a Magistrates Court the following morning."

Again, considering all aspects of the arson(and it was arson), a Canadian court would have dealt with her more harshly than you wish.

"Instead she spent 88 days in gaol at tax-payers expense."

That was because there was probable cause she had committed a crime. There was not probable cause that the innocent Lacrosse players raped Crystal. You criticize them because they chose not to spend time in jail at taxpayer expense. DA NIFONG wanted to put them away for a lot more than 88 days.

"I see in your election North Carolina bucked the trend. Too bad the Democratic Party didn't capture the House of Representatives as well. That way the U.S.A. might have a chance to join the civilized nations that have universal single payer health care, guaranteed for all from, cradle to grave. And no, we don't have death panels or rationed care. We can choose our own Doctors. Our people are healthier and longer living then Americans. Sorry I'm off topic."

And it was a Democrat Attorney General who bucked the racists and established that Crystal was not raped. Democrat DA NIFONG, in contrast, played to black racism to get innocent men convicted of a non existent crime.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

"Burning Walker's clothes should have resulted in a charge of willful damage instead of first degree arson."

This from someone who believes innocent men should have been charged with raping Crystal even though there was no evidence said rape ever happened.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

If one were to adopt your legal logic as it applies to the charge of arson against Crystal, one would have to believe that neither OJ Simpson nor Casey Anthony committed murder.

One difference between those cases and the Crystal Mangum arson case is that OJ Simpson and Casey Anthony were acquitted. Crystal was not acquitted of arson.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

Imagined situation.

Crystal goes on Judge Judy to sue the Durham police officer for the damage to her apartment.

Judge Judy would say something like:

Madam I have read your complaint. You admit setting the fire. The police officer called the fire department. You are suing him for the cost of smoke damage because you allege he could have extinguished the fire himself.

Madam, you are crazy. Case dismissed. Bird, get her out of here.

Nifong Supporter said...


Anonymous said...
SIDNEY HARR:

"I only know that she was taken to a clinic on March 24, 2011 by a friend. I have not as yet come across any medical records of the visit..."

An axiom of medical record keeping is, if it is not documented, it did not happen.

"and I do not know whether or not prosecution attempted to get copies of medical records of that visit. The prosecution should have tried to get the clinic medical records."

Why? How was that allegation relevant to the Reginald Daye stabbing?

Castigate Chris Shella and Woody Vann if you must, but the defense attorneys for the innocent, falsely accused Lacrosse players would have gotten the records had they felt they were relevant. Look at the effort they made to get the exculpatory evidence DA NIFONG tried to conceal from them.

Did Crystal ever mention the incident to her previous attorneys? If so, that would explain why they did not try to get the files.


Prosecutors should have investigated the claim that Mangum was assaulted by Daye a week prior to the stabbing. Of course it is relevant as it pertains to "prior acts" by Daye. It would also support that Mangum acted in self defense when she stabbed Daye.

The prosecution is pathetically woeful in its lack of a motive for the stabbing.

Also, for your edification, Mr. Nifong never attempted to conceal any discovery from the defense attorneys... rather, it was the other way around.

Nifong Supporter said...


Anonymous said...
SIDNEY HARR:

"


First of all, the March 24, 2011 abuse incident was one that I came upon while going through prosecution discovery. The statements came from a friend of Crystal who took her for medical treatment shortly after the incident. I do not know whether the prosecution obtained medical records of her visit for treatment."

That would indicate that the prosecution did not consider the statement of the friend of Crystal credible. If it was some friend of Crystal like yourself, that is understandable. I admit, if I were the prosecution, I would have sought records, if for no other reason to discredit them. Like in the Lacrosse case, one would expect DA NIFONG to have wanted to see exculpatory evidence the defense had so he could have had a chance to discredit it. He refused to look at exculpatory evidence.

"As far as the mainstream media goes, my feelings towards it has not changed, however, I plan on using the documents in an upcoming flog, so that is why I have not as yet posted them on the blog site."

As I predicted you are going to distort the info you have to make a case for Crystal.


With the prosecution having knowledge of the date and the place where Mangum was taken for medical treatment, they could've easily verified that she was taken for medical treatment at that time. Because Mangum denied signing any release of medical information, I doubt that the prosecution wanted to investigate the beating further lest it provide support for Mangum's assertion that she acted in self-defense.

I have no intention of distorting any facts, as I will present the evidence, for you to view for yourself. Surely I would not distort the evidence itself.

Nifong Supporter said...


Anonymous said...
SIDNEY HARR:

"The friend's statement acknowledges that on March 24, 2011, he took Mangum to a clinic after she was beaten up by Daye. Per his observations, Ms. Mangum's face and arms were swollen."

How does that establish that Crystal was beaten on April 11, 2011. Unless you can establish as fact that Crystal was beaten by Mr. Daye on March 24, you have compromised Crystal's defense. You have raised the possibility that any pictures you show of Crystal with facial and neck injuries were taken before April 1, 2011.

Bad move, SIDNEY, real bad move.


First, your comment has a factoid blemish as no one stated that Mangum was assaulted on April 11, 2011.

Evidence will show by statements of Crystal's friend that she was beaten on March 24, 2011, and that he transported her to a medical clinic that very day.

To my knowledge, no photographs of her injuries were taken at the March 24th clinic visit, so I don't believe they will be confused with the photos taken in the April 3, 2011 incident.

Nifong Supporter said...


Anonymous said...
since mangum is representing herself, she should have no problem at all obtaining her own medical records from the clinic that she supposedly visited in March. she can also compel the people who treated her at the clinic to testify, isn't that correct,Lance? And the mystery witness (another one, no doubt) who took her to the clinic can be made to testify. Of course, the prosecution will have access to these records and they will cross examine the medical staff from the clinic.
I can't wait to see these mystery photos of the April beating and, of course, the march beating.
hmmmmm, bro, why did mangum fail to call the police? why did she return to daye's apartment and shack up with him again after he beat her? why did the innocent mother of three expose her children to this obviously violent man? why has mangum waited all this time to remember this other march beating?


You are obviously ignorant of spousal domestic violence and its psychology. Many victims of domestic violence fail to report it to friends, family, or police out of shame and/or fear. Many victims of domestic violence return to the same violent living environments due to a variety of reasons including financial, fear, and contrition and promises made by the abuser.

To my knowledge, Daye was never abusive to the children.

Finally, Mangum never volunteered the information about the March 24th assault to me. I surprisingly and unexpectedly came upon it while going over the prosecution discovery. I then went to her and she confirmed it. So, it's not like she's coming out with this allegation all of a sudden and out of the clear blue.

Comprende? Let me know if more elucidation is required.

Anonymous said...

Sidney Mangum would have screamed her head off about a prior beating to every attorney she had. She did not do so. There was no prior beating to yell about. Don't be an idiot and try to pull this latest bandwidth wasting lie. You are not fooling anybody.

Anonymous said...

Bull crap. She is charged with murder. She would have screamed her head off about him beating her up before. She had only shacked with him for a few weeks. Don't try to pretend this was some long term spousal violence situation. She was shacking with the latest man who would pay for her and her children.

Anonymous said...

There will be medical records and photos. You said so. Where are they? Going to a clinic to get drugs which was her documented pattern, will not fly. Try again

Anonymous said...

So the prosecution had this so called discovery which she would have had to tell them about but she never told you ? Or Shella. Or Vann. ? Uh huh. And she went right back to Daye, and the friend witness has never come forward? Uh huh. And now suddenly we have this amazing discovery. Right

Anonymous said...

I have worked with domestic violence victims. I know the patterns. She does not fit the pattern at all. The person with convictions for violence against persons and property is Mangum. She has a boatload of charges involving violent acts. Care to compare her record to Daye's bro?

kenhyderal said...

Guiowen said: (you)"take refuge in claiming that you don't have to answer a sarcastic question"........... Can you give me an example of a "sarcastic" question I refused to answer?

guiowen said...

kenhyderal said...

"Guiowen said: (you)"take refuge in claiming that you don't have to answer a sarcastic question"........... Can you give me an example of a "sarcastic" question I refused to answer?"

A couple of days ago I suggested that you go to Durham, find Kilgo, and force him to give evidence. Your reply? "A sarcastic person is a wounded person."
Let's go over that. I admit it was not phrased in the form of a question, but it did beg for a reply. Therefore, let's consider the several points I made.

1. As a civilian employee of the Canadian armed forces, you are entitled to annual leave, or whatever the term for it is in Canada. You've been there at least since April of 2010, so you should have some accumulated leave. If not, then you have been using your leave for other things. Why? Aren't you concerned about helping Crystal?
2. A trip from Dubai to Raleigh-Durham takes about 25 hours each way -- admittedly a long trip, but it's not going to kill you. Have you been looking at plane schedules? If not, why not? Aren't you concerned about helping Crystal?
3. Canadian citizens do not require a visa to enter the United States. If you can't come to the United States, why not? Do you have some problems with the law here?
4. You state that an individual named Kilgo, who is (by your accounts) good and trustworthy (he even contributed to Crystal's bail fund in 2010!) can give you the name of someone who has important information. Do you still believe him to be trustworthy? If so, why aren't you trying to reach him? Aren't you concerned about helping Crystal?
5. In the United States, people with material information about a court case can be compelled to give testimony. This is known as subpoena power. Don't you think it would be a good idea to try to get this information from Kilgo? If not, why not? Aren't you concerned about helping Crystal?
6. People who do not refuse to answer questions can be sent to jail (gaol as you call it) until they give this information. Don't you think this would induce Kilgo to give the required information? If not, why not? What's Kilgo afraid of? Isn't Kilgo concerned about helping Crystal?

Now this is not sarcasm, at least as I define it. (Maybe you have a different definition.) I might call it irony -- Socratic irony. I imagine someone as well read as you is familiar with this term. (No sarcasm intended here.) I'm also using a technique known as reductio ad absurdum. I imagine someone as well read as you is familiar with this technique, from either Aristotle's Logic or from logicians of the present day. As a mathematician I can recommend Alonzo Church's Mathematical Logic.

Does that answer your question?

guiowen said...

Sorry, I have a typo in my last post. Point 6 should start

"People who refuse to answer questions can be sent to jail ..."

Otherwise I stand by all that I wrote there.

guiowen said...

Sidney,
Have you succeeded in getting the discovery photos? This would really help you to promulgate the truth, which as you know will set Crystal free.
Don't forget to get the photos time-stamped. That will really put the naysayers to shame.
Any luck in getting an appointment with Eric Holder? Now that the election is over, and he doesn't have to worry about Fast and Furious, I'm sure he'll be able to make time for you.

kenhyderal said...

@ Guiowen I am an employee of a company that is a private contractor. I have no charges against me in any jurisdiction in he world. I do not know the identity of "Kilgo". Crystal's only recourse now, in the Duke LaCrosse case, would be a civil suit. Time and the bungled Police investigation will make even such a civil action difficult, unless witnesses turn on the guilty. Restoring Crystal's reputation is the most important thing. For now she needs to resolve the bogus murder charge. I understand Socratic debate and I am a seeker of the truth. As a mathematician I am willing to learn from you but I find too often you are only facetious

guiowen said...

Kenhyderal,
Even private contractors give their employees leave, or vacation, or whatever they call it. If you really want the truth, you have to act.

The best way to restore Crystal's reputation is to show that she was not lying in 2006.This requires a visit to Durham. I don't understand why you have not attempted this.

guiowen said...

Kenyderal,
If you want to get Crystal out of jail now, you'd better go to Durham. If you sit back and wait for Sidney to solve this for you, Crystal will indeed get out of jail -- in 2021, after she finishes serving her 20-year sentence, with time off for good behavior and credit for time already served.

guiowen said...

Sidney,
I just read that Eric Holder might step down soon. You'd better hurry -- you never know what the next US Attorney General might be like.

kenhyderal said...

Anonymous @4:23 said: "Even though it(burning Walker's clothes) resulted in calling the Durham Fire Department(which resulted in SIDNEY falsely accusing a police officer of arson, something you apparently refuse to notice) and significant smoke damage to the dwelling"............. It was wrong for the Police to leave the clothes smouldering instead of turning on the water in the tub. This was what caused the smoke damage. "Going by the book" sometimes is inappropriate and common sense needs to be applied by professionals in the field. It was wrong of Dr. Harr to accuse the Police of burning the clothes Crystal admitted to doing that at the time of her arrest and the tape of her admission was shown to the jury. Dr.Harr misuderstood what Crystal said. She denied being guilty of felony arson and he apparently jumped to the conclusioon that the Police had burned Walker's clothes to frame Crystal.

kenhyderal said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
kenhyderal said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
kenhyderal said...

Here's a good example of the blatant sarcasm that poster Guiowen always resorts to......"Any luck in getting an appointment with Eric Holder? Now that the election is over, and he doesn't have to worry about Fast and Furious, I'm sure he'll be able to make time for you"......Don't be a bully drop the sarcasm

guiowen said...

Kenhyderal,
Sidney has told us time and again that the entire NC justice system is controlled by Rae Evans and her Carpetbaggers. If that is so, then Crystal's only hope is to take this to the next level of government -- the United States Federal government. You yourself mentioned some time ago that Eric Holder was busy with Fast and Furious. With the election past, and Holder talking about stepping down, this would be the time to get his help. As I mentioned, one never knows what the next A. G. might be like. Hence it's best to hurry. (But maybe you have some information about the next A.G.?)

It is true that Sidney is not doing much right now -- but whose fault is that? No one, so far as I can see, is doing anything for Crystal, but whose fault is that?

I, like most of the bloggers here, have no great interest in Crystal's fate. I give you and Sidney my advice as to what to do. It's not my fault if the two of you don't take it. All Sidney does is tell us that the truth will set Crystal free. All you do is loll about on the beach some place in Arabia.

I note that Break the Conspiracy, whom you have in the past touted as a "good guy", agrees with much of the advice I give. But maybe, because he agrees with me, you're going to denounce him -- just as you denounced Malek as soon as he stopped echoing you.

In brief, Ken, stop whining and do something!

Anonymous said...

Why would anybody want to do anything for Mangum? Every problem she faces has been brought on by her......her lies, her violence, her sexual escapades, her choice of men, her giving birth to three children without marriage and a stable home, her disobedience of the law and her stupid association with Harr. If anybody needs help it is the Daye family and the three children she popped out........but Mangum herself , sooner or later,is going to face the music.

Anonymous said...

KENHYERAL:

Quite unexpectedly this cabin has wifi!!!

"It was wrong for the Police to leave the clothes smouldering instead of turning on the water in the tub."

You have know way of knowing that the fire was that insignificant or that the police could have extinguished the fire.

"This was what caused the smoke damage."

There would have been no smoke damage had Crystal the arsonist not ignited the fire.

"Going by the book" sometimes is inappropriate and common sense needs to be applied by professionals in the field."

You were not in the field with the professionals, so you can not identify what was and was not common sense. Not that you would have been able to do so if you had been in the field, as you are totally lacking in common sense.

"It was wrong of Dr. Harr to accuse the Police of burning the clothes Crystal admitted to doing that at the time of her arrest and the tape of her admission was shown to the jury."

In other words, Crystal admitted to committing arson.

"Dr.Harr misuderstood what Crystal said. She denied being guilty of felony arson and he apparently jumped to the conclusioon that the Police had burned Walker's clothes to frame Crystal."

Crystal said she had no knowledge of the fire or of who said it. She lied and SIDNEY believed her.

See you the next time I log on.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

Here I am again, happily(for me) unexpectedly.

"@ Guiowen I am an employee of a company that is a private contractor. I have no charges against me in any jurisdiction in he world. I do not know the identity of 'Kilgo'".

So you admit you base your unreasonable guilt presuming racism on the word of an unknown, unverifiable source quoting another unknown unverifiable source. And you say you have common sense. HUH??!!

"Crystal's only recourse now, in the Duke LaCrosse case, would be a civil suit."

A civil suit was eliminated as an option for Crystal when she was thoroughly discredited as a false accuser.

"Time and the bungled Police investigation will make even such a civil action difficult, unless witnesses turn on the guilty."

Witnesses to what? It has been proven beyond a reasonable doubt that no crime happened( that an unreasonable guilt presuming racist does not accept this is meaningless).

"Restoring Crystal's reputation is the most important thing. For now she needs to resolve the bogus murder charge. I understand Socratic debate and I am a seeker of the truth."

If you were a seeker of the truth, you would not be seeking to prove that Crystal was raped.

"As a mathematician I am willing to learn from you but I find too often you are only facetious".

Is your belief, in the presence of overwhelming evidence to the contrary that Crystal was raped not facetious. HUH!!??

KHF Supporter said...

Guiowen:

I agree with your 9:20am comment.

I made a similar comment earlier. Ken claims to be a good friend of Crystal, upset that mystery rapists got away with a heinous crime, with information that could solve that crime, yet he does nothing except talk. Ken failed to address the comment, except a complaint that I described Kilgo as an "internet buddy" (he has not communicated with Kilgo except by e-mail). I noted that Kilgo may be traced through his ISP if Ken would go to the police.

I concluded that Ken was not a good friend of Crystal. This conclusion may not be correct. Ken, like Sidney, may believe the true sign of friendship is not action, but rather a willingness to comment on an infrequently visited blog site.

Poor Crystal. With friends like Ken and Sidney, she can expect to get out of jail in 2023, and the mystery rapists will still be free.






KHF Supporter said...

Ken: "Lance, Guiowen, Break, etc help the poor Dr. out he still doesn't get it."

ANONYMOUS (or as, Ken calls you, Dr. Anonymous):

As Ken's acolyte, let me make a number of observations.

1. Ken did not accuse you of beating your wife. He used a classic loaded question to illustrate a logical fallacy. You use a logical fallacy in accusing him of racism.

2. The presumption of innocence was handed down to the US and Canada from English law. It addresses how a court regards defendants. It is not binding on an internet commenter. Ken's ridiculous mystery rapist theory is not evidence that he fails to support the legal presumption of innocence. Similarly, those who conclude that Mangum is a prostitute do not observe the presumption of innocence. Although there is evidence to support that conclusion, she has not been convicted and thus is innocent. Stop using this straw man argument.

3. You overstate your case when you claim there is "no evidence" to support Ken's ridiculous mystery rapist theory. You mean only that there is no CREDIBLE evidence to support it. Mangum's allegation is evidence, albeit not credible given the lack of evidence to support it. Similarly, the allegation that Kilgo has an anonymous player source is also evidence, although also not credible and, as hearsay, not admissible in court. Be more precise.

4. Ken demonstrates good knowledge of the facts of the frame. Although he makes mistakes (either intentionally or not), his mystery rapist theory is a clever attempt to respond to the facts. Unlike Sidney, who ignores the known facts, Ken provides a theory that cannot be proven false (i.e., based on the failure to find DNA that matched the defendants, he concedes that the defendants did not rape Mangum and posits mystery rapists in their place).

5. Despite his protestations, Ken does not believe what he posts. He makes no attempt to convince others or to act on his knowledge. When I summarized his theory as two allegations supported by innuendo, he agreed, adding only the detail that the anonymous source was allegedly a player. Stop drawing conclusions based on his comments.

kenhyderal said...

Anonymous @ 6:13 PM said: "Is your belief, in the presence of overwhelming evidence to the contrary that Crystal was raped not facetious. HUH!!??"......... Dear Dr. Anonymous I don't think "belief" and being facetious both belong in the same accusation. So, no I assure you I post from conviction.

kenhyderal said...

@ KHF Supporter: At present. I am not accepting acolytes. As to your observations. #1 Thanks for also attempting to enlighten Dr. Anonymous. #2 There is no evidence that Crystal ever engaged in prostitution only anonymous accusations. # 3 DA Nifong thought the accusation was credible but the inadequate Police investigation failed to gather evidence that was, probably, available to support it. # 4 Two of the three charged were wrongly identified by a faulty photo line-up but everyone present, except Devon, was a potential suspect in the alleged rape. Other serious crimes were also alleged. Players, at the advice of thir Lawyers, stopped cooperating before a complete list of all who were present was determined. As a red-herring all Players both present and known not be present gave DNA samples, leading the public to believe only Players other then two guests who happened to show up in photographs were at the party. And finally #5 As I told Dr. Anonymous in my last post, "I post with conviction".

kenhyderal said...

KHF Supporter said: "Poor Crystal. With friends like Ken and Sidney, she can expect to get out of jail in 2023, and the mystery rapists will still be free"......... Crystal's priority, at present, has to be dealing with the bogus first degree murder charge and with regaining custody of her children; not in bringing to justice those who sexually assaulted her in 2006. There will be time enough for that later on. The ground work for that has been laid. Not to say we do not appreciate your, hopefully sincere, advice in this regard.

kenhyderal said...

Dr. Anonymous @ 6:04 said: In other words, Crystal admitted to committing arson"...... What Crystal admitted to did not rise to the level of arson. It was however wilfull damage and she did admitt to that.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

"Dear Dr. Anonymous I don't think "belief" and being facetious both belong in the same accusation. So, no I assure you I post from conviction."

So it is your conviction that, in the face of overwhelming evidence to the contrary, innocent Caucasian men are guilty of raping Crystal.

That qualifies as unreasonable, guilt presuming blatant unrepentant racism, even if you are unable to realize it.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

"@ KHF Supporter: At present. I am not accepting acolytes. As to your observations. #1 Thanks for also attempting to enlighten Dr. Anonymous."

Yes, thank you for enlightenment

"#2 There is no evidence that Crystal ever engaged in prostitution only anonymous accusations."

The finding of DNA from multiple males on multiple areas of Crystal's person is credible circumstantial evidence that she did engage in prostitution.


"# 3 DA Nifong thought the accusation was credible"

If true, DA NIFONG was totally incompetent. After forensic exam of the rape kit he had overwhelming evidence that no rape happened.

"but the inadequate Police investigation failed to gather evidence that was, probably, available to support it."

What KENNY cites as evidence is the finding of non Lax DNA on Crystal, from multiple males on multiple areas of her person, none of which males were Lacrosse players or party attendees. The evidence was non evidence, since the rape kit testing showed beyond a reasonable doubt that Crystal had not been raped at the Lacrosse party. Said non evidence was not evaluated because DA NIFONG, who KENNY says believed Crystal's allegation was credible, concealed the non evidence, because it exonerated those he had indicted for the non crime.

"# 4 Two of the three charged were wrongly identified by a faulty photo line-up but everyone present, except Devon, was a potential suspect in the alleged rape."

Which was a serious case of overcharging since Crystal never alleged the entire team participated in the non crime.

"Other serious crimes were also alleged."

At one point, Crystal alleged Kim Roberts/Pittman took her money.

"Players, at the advice of thir Lawyers, stopped cooperating before a complete list of all who were present was determined."

Players invoked their Constitutionality protected right to remain silent. A complete list of party attendees was compiled. KENNY's evidence that it was not was the non lax male DNA found on Crystal, and it was definitively shown that said DNA was not deposited on the night of 3/14 March 2006.

"As a red-herring all Players both present and known not be present gave DNA samples, leading the public to believe only Players other then two guests who happened to show up in photographs were at the party."

As was documented in Newsweek, the players could have fought the NTO as overreaching. They complied with the NTO. KENNY never explained why members of the Lacrosse team would cover up for non Lacrosse player perpetrators to the extent of allowing members of the team to be wrongfully prosecuted. He claims that someone witnessed a rape at the party. That comes from anonymous unverifiable Kilgo citing another anonymous source who is not verifiable, whose existence has not been proven for more than six years.

"And finally #5 As I told Dr. Anonymous in my last post, I post with conviction'."

What you call conviction is unreasonable guilt presuming blatant unrepentant racism.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:


"I have no intention of distorting any facts, as I will present the evidence, for you to view for yourself. Surely I would not distort the evidence itself."

Yes you have in the past and continue to do so in the present.

Nifong Supporter said...


guiowen said...
Sidney,
Have you succeeded in getting the discovery photos? This would really help you to promulgate the truth, which as you know will set Crystal free.
Don't forget to get the photos time-stamped. That will really put the naysayers to shame.
Any luck in getting an appointment with Eric Holder? Now that the election is over, and he doesn't have to worry about Fast and Furious, I'm sure he'll be able to make time for you.


gui, mon ami, I do have access to the photographs, and will post them soon... most likely in a flog. Try and be patient and also keep in mind that I did not take the photos, so I have no say in the time stamp not being present.

I haven't tried to contact Eric Holder yet, but I soon will. Right now I am busy working on a flog that I plan on having uploaded by next Tuesday... so that's why I have not had much time to spend at the library.

Nifong Supporter said...


Anonymous said...
Why would anybody want to do anything for Mangum? Every problem she faces has been brought on by her......her lies, her violence, her sexual escapades, her choice of men, her giving birth to three children without marriage and a stable home, her disobedience of the law and her stupid association with Harr. If anybody needs help it is the Daye family and the three children she popped out........but Mangum herself , sooner or later,is going to face the music.


So your position, if I'm not mistaken, is that because Crystal Mangum has made some mistakes in judgment in the past, she should not be entitled to protections offered by the Constitution and the justice system.

You see, I have a problem with that point of view. I believe all individuals, regardless of their past mistakes (and we all make them)are entitled to receive justice... that they should not be subjected to false and trumped up charges. I'm sure that I share that opinion with the Man from Nazareth.

Thereby may ye go enlightened.

Anonymous said...

"not in bringing to justice those who sexually assaulted her in 2006. There will be time enough for that later on. The ground work for that has been laid."

The statute of limitations on any criminal prosecution or civil suit for an alleged rape in North Carolina in 2006 has long passed.

guiowen said...

Kenhyderal:

Anonymous said...
"The statute of limitations on any criminal prosecution or civil suit for an alleged rape in North Carolina in 2006 has long passed."


I've been suggesting for over two years that you do something. According to the poster, the time to act on this has passed. I am not familiar with the statute of limitations in North Carolina, but it looks as though your failure to act on my suggestion has hurt Crystal.

kenhyderal said...

There is no statute of limitations on rape in North Carolina. I've checked that out.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

"

So your position, if I'm not mistaken, is that because Crystal Mangum has made some mistakes in judgment in the past, she should not be entitled to protections offered by the Constitution and the justice system.

You see, I have a problem with that point of view. I believe all individuals, regardless of their past mistakes (and we all make them)are entitled to receive justice... that they should not be subjected to false and trumped up charges."

Funny. You claimed that past offenses of the members of the Lacrosse team, misdemeanors, were probable cause for charging them with rape, a rape which did not occur.

"I'm sure that I share that opinion with the Man from Nazareth."

The Man from Nazareth does not condone lying. You lie all the time in your blog. That is evidence you are a minion of the father of lies, not of the Man from Nazareth.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

"gui, mon ami, I do have access to the photographs, and will post them soon... most likely in a flog. Try and be patient and also keep in mind that I did not take the photos, so I have no say in the time stamp not being present."

Which means you can not prove as fact that the pictures were taken on April 11, 2011 and not on any other date.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

"gui, mon ami, I do have access to the photographs, and will post them soon... most likely in a flog. Try and be patient and also keep in mind that I did not take the photos, so I have no say in the time stamp not being present."

Which means you can not prove as fact that the pictures were taken on April 11, 2011 and not on any other date.

Crystal may have been beaten on March 24, 2011. However it is not credible that she was beaten by Reginald Daye. How do we know that the pictures you are going to show are from April 11, 2011?

guiowen said...

kenhyderal said...

"There is no statute of limitations on rape in North Carolina. I've checked that out."

Fine. Now do something!

kenhyderal said...

Guiowen said: "Fine. Now do something"..... Step one; deal with the presnt bogus charge that Crystal is facing. Since the $200,000 bail is beyond our reach having the charges dropped or fighting the charges and winning seems to be the best course of action. Crystal and Dr.Harr are working towards that end and are having success in that endeavor.

kenhyderal said...

Anonymous @4:16 said: "none of which males were Lacrosse players or party attendees:.......... Are you making the claim that the investigation produced a complete list of all who were present during the time Crystal and Kim were known to be there? Why were DNA samples taken from Players who could absolutely prove they were not there? Were Players, identified as present, questioned as to whom, other then fellow, team members were at the party? Why were there no charges laid for the stealing money from Crystal's purse? I'm sorry dissatisfied clients can't do that. Their only recourse would have been a civil action. Despite being drugged and raped Crysal was concerned about the money because part of it belonged to her agent and she needed her portion to feed her children. Incidently the Durham Police still have the money, recovered, and attempts by Crystal to have it returned have been futile. Does this suggest, despite AG Cooper's pronouncement, the investigation has not been closed?

kenhyderal said...

Dr.Anonymous @ 3:57 said: "So it is your conviction that, in the face of overwhelming evidence to the contrary, innocent Caucasian men are guilty of raping Crystal.
That qualifies as unreasonable, guilt presuming blatant unrepentant racism, even if you are unable to realize it"....... There you go again, for the umteenth time invoking race. I'm telling you that the race of those I believe sexually assaulted Crystal is absolutely immaterial to me. Is it just me, or do others find that Dr. Anonymous constantly using, the meaningless and racially charged, term Caucasian indicates a belief that so-called reverse racism is a major problem in America? Whether this phenomena even exists, except in a maginalized tiny percent, is a subject of debate in American Universities. I can guarantee, though, that there is a lot more endemic racism against people of color in America, by many fold, then there is the so called reverse racism which Dr. Anonymous seems so obsessed with charging me with.

Anonymous said...

Kenhyderal - Face reality.No white man would ever want to have sex with Crystal Mangum much less go to all the trouble of gang raping her in a bathroom that was too small.

Anonymous said...

Isn't it fun to listen to Kenny pontificate and Harr preach. This is better than a Jesse Jackson sermon! The troll wants us to believe he is an intellectual and Bro wants us to believe he has a brain. The "man from Glad" Jesus reference is one of my favorite righteous lines from preacher Harr. Suggest to you, bro, that the children and the Daye family are the ones who need help...........not the trash who exposed the babies to violence and killed the man. You wanna invoke Jesus, then how about you get off your backside and do some Christian love for the real victims ?

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

"Anonymous @4:16 said: "none of which males were Lacrosse players or party attendees:.......... Are you making the claim that the investigation produced a complete list of all who were present during the time Crystal and Kim were known to be there?"

Yes.

"Why were DNA samples taken from Players who could absolutely prove they were not there?"

Because DA NIFONG was out to convict members of the Lacrosse team for the non existent rape.

"Were Players, identified as present, questioned as to whom, other then fellow, team members were at the party?"

Apparently yes, since prosecution and defense were agreed that everyone present had been identified. Was did Kim Roberts/Pittman say that there were people there who had not been identified? The only people who say there were unidentified assailants are you and Kilgo, neither one of whom has first hand knowledge.

"Why were there no charges laid for the stealing money from Crystal's purse? I'm sorry dissatisfied clients can't do that. Their only recourse would have been a civil action."

The most obvious answer is, DA NIFONG was concerned only about convicting members of the Lacrosse team of the non crime.

"Despite being drugged and raped Crysal was concerned about the money because part of it belonged to her agent and she needed her portion to feed her children."

Crystal was neither drugged nor raped by anyone at the party. You have been unable to provide any evidence, factual or otherwise.

"Incidently the Durham Police still have the money, recovered, and attempts by Crystal to have it returned have been futile."

So if anyone is guilty of keeping Crystal's money, it is the Durham Police.

"Does this suggest, despite AG Cooper's pronouncement, the investigation has not been closed?"

What evidence do you have to show the investigation os ongoing?

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

"Dr.Anonymous @ 3:57 said: "So it is your conviction that, in the face of overwhelming evidence to the contrary, innocent Caucasian men are guilty of raping Crystal.
That qualifies as unreasonable, guilt presuming blatant unrepentant racism, even if you are unable to realize it"....... There you go again, for the umteenth time invoking race. I'm telling you that the race of those I believe sexually assaulted Crystal is absolutely immaterial to me."

You are telling me for the umpteenth time you are in denial about your unreasonable guilt presuming racism, just like you are in denial about the fact that Crystal is a false accuser.

"Is it just me, or do others find that Dr. Anonymous constantly using, the meaningless and racially charged, term Caucasian indicates a belief that so-called reverse racism is a major problem in America?"

The false allegations lodged against the innocent Caucasian men(an innocuous term except to a blatant unrepentant racist) embraced by the durham county black electorate, embraced by the new black panther party, by such notables as Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton(of Tawana Brawley fame), Karla Holloway, Houston the farm animal Baker, show black on white racism exists.

"Whether this phenomena even exists, except in a maginalized tiny percent, is a subject of debate in American Universities."

The people in said universities are in denial, just like you.

I can guarantee, though, that there is a lot more endemic racism against people of color in America, by many fold, then there is the so called reverse racism which Dr. Anonymous seems so obsessed with charging me with."

You mean the racism about which you are in denial. What do you call racism against people of color - innocent Caucasian men defending themselves against Crystal's false allegations of rape?

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

Other notables embracing black on white racism in the Duke phony rape case include the North Carolina NAACP(I know you are going to go into denial about this, but Professor Johnson has detailed instances in which the NAACP has advocated against items for the innocent Caucasian defendants, such a change in venue when the venue in which the alleged crime was committed has been biased against the accused, which they have advocated for when people of color are the accused) and the New Black Panther Party. I also name black attorney Irving Joyner who also advocated against a change of venue.

How do I know Durham had been biased? For one thing, on March 27, 2006, DA NIFONG, before he had any facts about the case, declared in public that a crime had happened, that members of the Lacrosse team were the perpetrators, and that the said alleged crime had been racially motivated. You are also in denial that DA NIFONG made that statement, even though it has been documented.

KHF Supporter said...

Ken:

In my opinion, the DPD did not conduct a bona fide investigation of the rape allegation because they had decided to conduct a frame. They were concerned that a real investigation would uncover evidence that would make a frame more difficult. Their failure to conduct an investigation is evidence that they didn't find Crysal's rape allegation to be credible.

Similarly, the DPD failed to investigate the theft allegation at all, despite being given by Evans the names of two players who had taken some of Crystal's money. He told them to put it back. An investigation of the theft might have uncovered evidence that would compromise the intended frame on rape.

If, as you suggest, Nifong did not know that the DPD was trying to frame players, then he is incredibly stupid and utterly incompetent. I am willing to discuss his stupidity and incompetence.

By the way, the statute of limitations has run out on misdemeanor theft. There is no ongoing investigation. The DPD never investigated. They don't start after more than six years.

kenhyderal said...

Anonymous @ 4:46 said: "What do you call racism against people of color - "innocent" (my quotations) Caucasian men defending themselves against Crystal's "false" (my quotations) allegations of rape"................. No, in this instance trying to defend themselves is their right. In the American justice system, though, racial profiling is rampant. The enforcement of drug laws is biased. The incarceration rate of Afican Americans is disproportional. In the area of Education, Schools in poor and minority areas are not funded equitably. The disgraceful American health care system is stacked against the poor who are disproportionally minorities.

kenhyderal said...

Anonymous said: "What evidence do you have to show the investigation os ongoing?"............... Only that this was the excuse she was given for not returning her $260.00Not to mention the other $140.00

KHF Supporter said...

So, Ken, no comment on the allegation that the DPD attempted a frame?

You asked a number of questions about the DPD's failure to investigate. Don't ask questions if you don't want to consider the possible explanations.

guiowen said...

kenhyderal said...

'Guiowen said: "Fine. Now do something"..... Step one; deal with the presnt bogus charge that Crystal is facing. Since the $200,000 bail is beyond our reach having the charges dropped or fighting the charges and winning seems to be the best course of action. Crystal and Dr.Harr are working towards that end and are having success in that endeavor.'

O.K., don't take my advice. Just don't come back whining when everything goes wrong.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDEFAAL:

"Anonymous @ 4:46 said: "What do you call racism against people of color - "innocent" (my quotations) Caucasian men defending themselves against Crystal's "false" (my quotations) allegations of rape"................."

Again you show you are in denial about facts, Crystal falsely accused Caucasian Lacrosse players of raping her and said Lacrosse players are in fact innocent.

"No, in this instance trying to defend themselves is their right. In the American justice system, though, racial profiling is rampant. The enforcement of drug laws is biased. The incarceration rate of Afican Americans is disproportional. In the area of Education, Schools in poor and minority areas are not funded equitably. The disgraceful American health care system is stacked against the poor who are disproportionally minorities."

None of this is relevant to the facts that Crystal was not raped and that the men she falsely accused are innocent, in fact.

kenhyderal said...

KHF Supporter said : "So, Ken, no comment on the allegation that the DPD attempted a frame?"......... I've chalked it up to gross incompetence. This paved the way for the Players legal team to exploit this sloppy and inadequate investigation to their clients benefit.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

"Anonymous said: "What evidence do you have to show the investigation os ongoing?"............... Only that this was the excuse she was given for not returning her $260.00Not to mention the other $140.00"

So what you are admitting is that the Police are responsible for Crystal's loss of her money. So why would they be continuing an investigation which would show they are thieves, not anyone at the Lacrosse party.

Incidentally it is moot that the money was legally Crystal's. She was to perform for a certain length of time, which she could not do because she arrived at the party impaired(you can show no evidence, circumstantial or otherwise, that she was drugged at the party).

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

"KHF Supporter said : "So, Ken, no comment on the allegation that the DPD attempted a frame?"......... I've chalked it up to gross incompetence. This paved the way for the Players legal team to exploit this sloppy and inadequate investigation to their clients benefit."

The issue is, who knew early on in the case the only people who knew that the only male DNA found on Crystal(multiple males on multiple areas of her person) did not match any of those men who had attended the party(there were no unidentified party attendees)? The only ones who knew were DA NIFONG and a few members of the police. What you call a botched investigation was the lawyers for the defense uncovering this exculpatory evidence which DA NIFONG tried to conceal.

That the investigation was botched was irrelevant to the three innocent Lacrosse players whom Crystal falsely accused of rape? She lied about the rape in the first place. Even if the police investigation had not been what you call botched, it would have provided no evidence that the crime had happened.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

What was the exact date and time that the police said the investigation of Crystal's money was ongoing?

KHF Supporter said...

Ken claims: This paved the way for the Players legal team to exploit this sloppy and inadequate investigation to their clients benefit.

This was not a "sloppy and inadequate" investigation. It was essentially no investigation, designed primarily to avoid uncovering evidence that would clear the defendants selected for the frame.

A deliberate frame would also leave the City of Durham at risk.

I am surprised that you dismiss out of hand the theory that the DPD attempted a frame. You make no attempt to explain the many, many failures of the investigation.

Do you honestly believe that Gottlieb and Himan were complete morons? Do you honestly believe that the investigation for one of the biggest cases in Durham history would be entrusted to fools? Do you honestly believe that the DPD would not have supervised this investigation closely, particularly after media reports surfaced, which described a failed investigation?

No one could make that many mistakes if they acted in good faith.

The frame and your ridiculous mystery rapist theory are not mutually exclusive. If a rape had actually occurred, and the DPD did nothing to try to solve the crime, but rather to frame other people, Crystal's friends and supporters should livid.

KHF Supporter said...

So, Ken, do you want to discuss Nifong's stupidity and incompetence? How about his laziness?

You insist that he found Crystal's rape allegation to be credible. He knew that the DPD had failed to investigate and had uncovered little credible evidence to support the inconsistent allegations. He knew Crystal had failed to identify her alleged assailants and that the DNA matched none of the players. He knew the identification procedure was unreliable.

Nifong proceded with a prosecution based on what he later conceded consisted of "no credible evidence" to support the charges.

Ken, let's discuss Nifong's stupidity, incompetence and laziness. It is either that or his dishonesty.

kenhyderal said...

Anonymous @ 1:34 said: "None of this is relevant to the facts that Crystal was not raped and that the men she falsely accused are innocent, in fact"............. Your question was "What do you call racism against people of colour", that I gave examples of. Is Crystal a racist for describing her attackers as white? That she did so is not surprizing, since there was only one African American at the party and he supposedly left before the performance was interrupted by obscene remarks. Am I racist for believing, from what she told me, that she was drugged, robbed and sexually asaulted at that same party? Have we singled out persons unfairly because of their race? You cant get away with screaming black on white racism in this case.

KHF Supporter said...

ANONYMOUS:

That the investigation was botched

I disagree with you phrasing. This investigation was not "botched." To call an investigation "botched" suggests that mistakes were made.

The DPD did not conduct a bona investigation. They did not make some "mistakes" in their work.

This prosecution was almost certainly a deliberate frame of three young men for a crime that Nifong and the DPD knew had never occurred.

The DPD investigation violated departmental guidelines and procedures. Virtually every step of this investigation was deeply flawed. The DPD repeatedly failed to interview witnesses, investigate available evidence, re-interview witnesses when their statements were contradicted by evidence, and, most importantly, make any attempt to reconcile the many versions of the accuser’s story or to challenge her when her accusation was contradicted by all other evidence. The DPD ignored, avoided and ultimately hid exculpatory evidence. They allegedly attempted to create evidence by filing inaccurate affidavits and reports, providing false and misleading testimony before the grand jury, and intimidating and influencing witnesses. Members of the DPD apparently violated policy with their inflammatory public statements, the method in which they conducted lineups, and their failure to maintain a contemporaneous record of their activities.

This deeply flawed investigation demonstrated a complete failure in the DPD chain of command. Senior DPD officers apparently either failed to supervise the investigation or failed themselves to follow standard procedure.

Information available in media reports and in defense filings showed a case that had no substance and had fallen apart. In spite of these obvious problems, the chain of command took no apparent action. They either failed to step in to review the investigation or demonstrated an utter inability to comprehend its failure.

I ask that you not describe this faux investigation as "botched" in the future. Thank you.

KHF Supporter said...

Ken asks: Am I racist for believing, from what she told me, that she was drugged, robbed and sexually asaulted at that same party?

Once again, I come to your support.

I agree that charges of racism directed against you solely on the basis of your comments is unfair.

Are you are racist for believing Crystal? No. If you believe your ridiculous mystery rapist theory, you are only a fool, but not a racist.

As I have noted earlier, I do not believe that you actually believe this nonsense. Your actions are not consistent with belief.

I have concluded that your comments are intended only to annoy other posters, with no other nefarious objectives.

KHF Supporter said...

Typos corrected.
ANONYMOUS:

That the investigation was botched

I disagree with your phrasing. This investigation was not "botched." To call an investigation "botched" suggests that mistakes were made.

The DPD did not conduct a bona fide investigation. They did not make some "mistakes" in their work.

This prosecution was almost certainly a deliberate frame of three young men for a crime that Nifong and the DPD knew had never occurred.

The DPD investigation violated departmental guidelines and procedures. Virtually every step of this investigation was deeply flawed. The DPD repeatedly failed to interview witnesses, investigate available evidence, re-interview witnesses when their statements were contradicted by evidence, and, most importantly, make any attempt to reconcile the many versions of the accuser’s story or to challenge her when her accusation was contradicted by all other evidence. The DPD ignored, avoided and ultimately hid exculpatory evidence. They allegedly attempted to create evidence by filing inaccurate affidavits and reports, providing false and misleading testimony before the grand jury, and intimidating and influencing witnesses. Members of the DPD apparently violated policy with their inflammatory public statements, the method in which they conducted lineups, and their failure to maintain a contemporaneous record of their activities.

This deeply flawed investigation demonstrated a complete failure in the DPD chain of command. Senior DPD officers apparently either failed to supervise the investigation or failed themselves to follow standard procedure.

Information available in media reports and in defense filings showed a case that had no substance and had fallen apart. In spite of these obvious problems, the chain of command took no apparent action. They either failed to step in to review the investigation or demonstrated an utter inability to comprehend its failure.

I ask that you not describe this faux investigation as "botched" in the future. Thank you.

kenhyderal said...

Anonymous @ 1:47 said: "What was the exact date and time that the police said the investigation of Crystal's money was ongoing"....... I'll try and obtain this information from Crystal. I know it was sometime after AG Coopers proclamation.

kenhyderal said...

KHF Supporter said; "Are you are racist for believing Crystal? No. If you believe your ridiculous mystery rapist theory, you are only a fool, but not a racist"........... I am not salved by your acknowledgement that I am not a racist but instead a fool?

KHF Supporter said...

Ken:

I do not conclude that you are a fool. I made that clear.

kenhyderal said...

KHF Supporter said : "As I have noted earlier, I do not believe that you actually believe this nonsense. Your actions are not consistent with belief"............. You can speculate all you want about what I belive. If I am claiming here I believe things I really do not what do you speculate my motive is, for doing so. Instead of wanting to annoy people here I am trying to challenge the wrong-headed views and one-sided evidence they have been so thoroughly indoctrinated with.

KHF Supporter said...

Ken:

You are not trying to "challenge" other views. If you did, you would make an attempt to persuade others. You do not do so.

I characterized your theory as a couple of allegations supported by innuendo. You did not dispute that characterization, adding only some details.

Your acceptance of my discussion without major objection made me wonder whether you are writing satire, with Sidney and other Nifong apologists as your real target. Only Sidney is too dense to understand that you are making fun of him.

guiowen said...

Kenhyderal
I hope you see how people feel about your arguments. If you really want us to change our minds you had better locate Kilgo and get the information he has -- that is if he really exists and has this information.
You can take my advice or you can tell me that "a sarcastic man is a wounded man" or something of the sort. It doesn't much matter to me -- it's not my bosom buddy that's in jail.

kenhyderal said...

KHF Supporter said : "Your acceptance of my discussion without major objection made me wonder whether you are writing satire, with Sidney and other Nifong apologists as your real target. Only Sidney is too dense to understand that you are making fun of him".................. Satire makes fun of people's foibles but sarcasm intends to wound. When have I ever made fun of Dr.Harr? He is a person I admire even though we disagree on tacticts and I find his reluctance to back me up with facts, I know he has, often perplexing. I particularly admire his forebearance and his ability to turn the other cheek when pilloried. Myself, I tend to want to fight back, hence my numerous posts since I am under attack by a myriad of posters.

kenhyderal said...

Guiowen said: "You can take my advice"......... Like your advice to hurry up and involve AG Eric Holder in the Duke Lacrosse case before he retires. Your sarcasm is meant to wound. Don't worry Guiowen at an appropriate time the eye witness Kilgo spoke of will be idetified and compelled to testify.

guiowen said...

kenhyderal said...

' Don't worry Guiowen at an appropriate time the eye witness Kilgo spoke of will be idetified and compelled to testify.'

He won't appear unless you do something about it. But what makes yoi think I'm worrying?

November 10, 2012 9:08 PM

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

"Anonymous @ 1:47 said: "What was the exact date and time that the police said the investigation of Crystal's money was ongoing"....... I'll try and obtain this information from Crystal. I know it was sometime after AG Coopers proclamation."

That was over 6 years ago. What current information do you have? None?

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

" I am not salved by your acknowledgement that I am not a racist but instead a fool?"

I would call you vicious, insisting in the face of overwhelming evidence to the contrary, innocent men raped Crystal.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

"KHF Supporter said : "As I have noted earlier, I do not believe that you actually believe this nonsense. Your actions are not consistent with belief"............. You can speculate all you want about what I belive. If I am claiming here I believe things I really do not what do you speculate my motive is, for doing so."

Whatever your motive is, the fact is that you, in the face of overwhelming evidence to the contrary, you accuse innocent men of raping Crystal. That indicates an unworthy motive.

"Instead of wanting to annoy people here I am trying to challenge the wrong-headed views and one-sided evidence they have been so thoroughly indoctrinated with."

What evidence do you have that a rape occurred? You have only Crystal's allegations and Kilgo's unverifiable information from an anonymous source the existence of whom has never been proven. What is wrongheaded and one sided is your insistence that the overwhelming factual evidence that no rape occurred should be discarded in favor of your unsupported allegations.

I challenge you again, without dragging in red herrings, to demonstrate evidence that a rape occurred.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

"KHF Supporter said : "Your acceptance of my discussion without major objection made me wonder whether you are writing satire, with Sidney and other Nifong apologists as your real target. Only Sidney is too dense to understand that you are making fun of him".................. Satire makes fun of people's foibles but sarcasm intends to wound. When have I ever made fun of Dr.Harr? He is a person I admire even though we disagree on tacticts and I find his reluctance to back me up with facts, I know he has, often perplexing."

That is circumstantial evidence that SIDNEY has no facts to offer. You de facto you have no facts to support your allegations.

"I particularly admire his forebearance and his ability to turn the other cheek when pilloried."

Likewise you admire his attempts to pillory the falsely accused innocent Duke Lacrosse players.

"Myself, I tend to want to fight back, hence my numerous posts since I am under attack by a myriad of posters."

What you call attacks are the multiple posts showing you are accusing innocent men of raping Crystal in the face of overwhelming evidence to the contrary. I also say, you call attacks that I call out your blatant unreasonable guilt presuming racism.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

P.S.

You fight back very ineffectively.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

"Don't worry Guiowen at an appropriate time the eye witness Kilgo spoke of will be idetified and compelled to testify."

I do not worry because that supposed eye witness does not exist.

You admit you can provide no facts to prove said witness exists. You depend on SIDNEY to provide facts when SIDNEY has never posted any facts in all the years he has been blogging.

SIDNEY provided no facts in his frivolous lawsuit against Duke.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

"Anonymous @ 1:34 said: "None of this is relevant to the facts that Crystal was not raped and that the men she falsely accused are innocent, in fact"............. Your question was "What do you call racism against people of colour", that I gave examples of. Is Crystal a racist for describing her attackers as white? That she did so is not surprizing, since there was only one African American at the party and he supposedly left before the performance was interrupted by obscene remarks."

According to you, originally Devon Sherwood was not present at the party. And there was only one exchange of racial epithets, which was initiated by person of color Kim Roberts/Pittman.

"Am I racist for believing, from what she told me, that she was drugged, robbed and sexually asaulted at that same party?"

I say yes since there is overwhelming evidence to the contrary that Crystal was raped.

"Have we singled out persons unfairly because of their race?"

Crystal singled herself out by falsely accusing innocent Caucasian Duke Lacrosse players of rape. The Lacrosse players were singled out for persecution because of their race, and you support their persecution by DA NIFONG.

"You cant get away with screaming black on white racism in this case."

No one has to scream it. Black on White Racism is what gave this case its notoriety and infamy.

KHF Supporter said...

Ken:

Thanks for your response. You confirmed my suspicions.

kenhyderal said...

Suspicion is the companion of mean souls, and the bane of all good society. Thomas Paine

guiowen said...

What, can the devil quote scripture?

Nifong Supporter said...


Anonymous said...
Sidney Mangum would have screamed her head off about a prior beating to every attorney she had. She did not do so. There was no prior beating to yell about. Don't be an idiot and try to pull this latest bandwidth wasting lie. You are not fooling anybody.


That a male friend of Crystal's took her to get medical treatment on March 24, 2011, is recorded in prosecution documents. When I was reviewing prosecution documents that is how I came upon it. I asked Crystal why she hadn't told me about it earlier, and she said that she was embarrassed about having returned to live with Reginald Daye after he had beaten her up. This is classic for victims in domestic violent relationships.

I provided media with the documentation long ago... and they don't want to discuss it. I will present it here shortly in an upcoming flog.

Nifong Supporter said...


kenhyderal said...
Suspicion is the companion of mean souls, and the bane of all good society. Thomas Paine


That is what I love about this blog site. It is educational and enlightening on so many levels. Shirley you would not find a Thomas Paine quote on a site such as "Liestoppers" or "Durham-in-Wonderland."

Nifong Supporter said...


Anonymous said...
Isn't it fun to listen to Kenny pontificate and Harr preach. This is better than a Jesse Jackson sermon! The troll wants us to believe he is an intellectual and Bro wants us to believe he has a brain. The "man from Glad" Jesus reference is one of my favorite righteous lines from preacher Harr. Suggest to you, bro, that the children and the Daye family are the ones who need help...........not the trash who exposed the babies to violence and killed the man. You wanna invoke Jesus, then how about you get off your backside and do some Christian love for the real victims ?


Anonymous, you need to repent for your vile comment. But if not, not to worry, for I will pray for you... "Lord, forgiveth this fool, for he knoweth not what he sayeth."

Nifong Supporter said...


Anonymous said...
SIDNEY HARR:

"gui, mon ami, I do have access to the photographs, and will post them soon... most likely in a flog. Try and be patient and also keep in mind that I did not take the photos, so I have no say in the time stamp not being present."

Which means you can not prove as fact that the pictures were taken on April 11, 2011 and not on any other date.

Crystal may have been beaten on March 24, 2011. However it is not credible that she was beaten by Reginald Daye. How do we know that the pictures you are going to show are from April 11, 2011?


April 11, 2011...? That was two days before Daye was removed from life support and died. What is the significance of that date? Is it merely a mistake? Please expound further as I require much elucidation in this matter.



Anonymous said...

Wow bro I thought you Christians were not into judging........judge not, .
Lest ye be, and all that. " vile comment, yet"? Whew, preacher Harr is in the house today!!! I agree with the poster.......the victims here are the children who have been exposed to violence, drunken brawls, sexual circuses, and the morals of a house cat. There is a dead man who you "vilely" called an alcoholic which Is a lie. I' d say you best get on your knees and do your own repenting for the racist lies you have told.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

"Suspicion is the companion of mean souls, and the bane of all good society. Thomas Paine"

What does that say about you who, in the face of overwhelming evidence that Crystal was not raped, devote yourself to expressing your suspicion that she was?

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

"Anonymous, you need to repent for your vile comment. But if not, not to worry, for I will pray for you... "Lord, forgiveth this fool, for he knoweth not what he sayeth."

SIDNEY you should be praying intensely. You know what you are saying but you lack the basic morality to recognize what you are saying consists of lies.

The Man from Nazareth does not condone lies. You proclaim yet another lie when you claim you follow the Man from Nazareth.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

"That is what I love about this blog site. It is educational and enlightening on so many levels. Shirley you would not find a Thomas Paine quote on a site such as "Liestoppers" or "Durham-in-Wonderland."

Maybe not. But you would not find people like you propagating lies in the name of the One who said He was the Way, the TRUTH(emphasis added) and the Life. Look in a mirror SIDNEY.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR"

"April 11, 2011...? That was two days before Daye was removed from life support and died. What is the significance of that date? Is it merely a mistake? Please expound further as I require much elucidation in this matter."

Okay, SIDNEY, you got me. I got the date of the Ronald Daye stabbing.

I will rephrase. You can not document that the photos you might have showing Crystal with facial injuries were taken by the police on the day Crystal was arrested for the stabbing of Reginald Daye.

Someone knowledgeable enlighten me(that leaves you out SIDNEY) but since police photos would have value as evidence, aren't police photos date and time stamped? If said photos were not date and time stamped, would they not be valueless as evidence.

SIDNEY is saying he has photos of Crystal showing she suffered a beating but he can not document when they were taken.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

"That a male friend of Crystal's took her to get medical treatment on March 24, 2011, is recorded in prosecution documents. When I was reviewing prosecution documents that is how I came upon it."

Did you come across any medical records? If not, it did not happen. Medical Maxim, of which I have already reminded you: If it is not documented, it did not happen.

"I asked Crystal why she hadn't told me about it earlier, and she said that she was embarrassed about having returned to live with Reginald Daye after he had beaten her up. This is classic for victims in domestic violent relationships."

It is also classic(Mary Winkler, Nancy Seaman) for women who have committed murder to allege domestic abuse when they are charged with Murder 1.

"I provided media with the documentation long ago... and they don't want to discuss it. I will present it here shortly in an upcoming flog."

Did you present the media with the medical records documenting the beating. What evidence do you have, except for Crystal's statement, that Reginald Daye beat her. You allege Reginald Daye beat her when he was stabbed, but no photographs, no police records, no medical record document that.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

"That a male friend of Crystal's took her to get medical treatment on March 24, 2011, is recorded in prosecution documents."

Who was the male friend? Kilgo? Did Kilgo get his information from some anonymous, unverifiable source who claimed to be an eye witness?

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

"But if not, not to worry, for I will pray for you... "Lord, forgiveth this fool, for he knoweth not what he sayeth."

I think your acolyte, KENHYDERAL, referred to a passage, I think it was in Matthew, to the effect that the Father of the Man from Nazareth considered it a major offense to call someone a fool.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

The Man from Nazareth, who spoke the words, Father forgive them for they know not what they do, did not call the people, for whom He prayed, fools.

And you have the nerve to call yourself as a follower of the Man from Nazareth.

Anonymous said...

The racist from Raleigh loves to throw around his references to Jesus when he is confronted with the truth of his racism and his lies. Wanna tell us why you lied about the lax house demolition? Wanna admit you lied about Daye? Wanna admit you lied about the fire setting episode and falsely accused ? Wanna admit you lied about the nonexistent photos of Mangum?
Come on preacher .......tell us evil folks all about how you called a dead man an alcoholic......

kenhyderal said...

Anonymous Said: "the Father of the Man from Nazareth considered it a major offense to call someone a fool"......... That was the "Man from Nazareth" himself; however, you have to take it in context because in several other instances he, himself, called unbelievers fools

kenhyderal said...

Nifong Supporter said: "That is what I love about this blog site. It is educational and enlightening on so many levels. Shirley you would not find a Thomas Paine quote on a site such as "Liestoppers" or "Durham-in-Wonderland."
......... For that reason and others surely Shirley will prefer J4n over DIW or Duke LaCrosse Liestoppers.

Anonymous said...

Jesus was born in Bethlehem. He was not from Nazereth. You'd think a man who invokes religion to hide his lies would know this.

Anonymous said...

Uh oh, another Mangum "male friend"? If I were this guy, I would be very nervous around Sister, anywhere near cutlery!

guiowen said...

kenhyderal said...

" For that reason and others surely Shirley will prefer J4n over DIW or Duke LaCrosse Liestoppers."

Have you no shame? Mocking a kindly old man because of a spelling mistake? This from someone who makes an average of seven mistakes per post! Talk about the pot calling the kettle black!

Anonymous said...

Personally, I kinda like the Man from Glad in reference to Jesus. After all, "glad" was the essence of his message, wasn't it. Also, I happen to agree with the poster that Harr frequently hides behind his standard shields such as, " I don't recall, please enlighten me". or Jesus references,, or "I am going to write a stupendous flob about that, stay tuned". or, "the truth will set her free"....etc....etc.....
His best avoidance technique is simply ignoring questions about his lies when he is confronted directly.
I guess Mangum is getting all set for her court date this week. Surely we will finally have the Big Reveal....and all the photos of the hour of sheer terror will finally set her free!!!!

Anonymous said...

I think it's hilarious that Thomas Paine is being glorified on this blog......in the same space with Harr ranting about Jesus. too bleepin funny. Paine wrote The Age of Reason and he absolutely blistered christian doctrine in it. Lordy, what fun it is to read Kenny-Harr comic strips.

Anonymous said...

Top Ten Harr Lies:
1. Duke violated my civil rights
2. Professor Coleman is a close friend of mine
3. Mangum didn't set the fire
4. The LAX house was immediately demolished and in a clandestine manner
5. There are photos showing a severe beating by Reginald Daye, punching, choking, and eye gouging
6. There are photos that show Mangum beaten by Daye in March 2011
7. Mangum has never been convicted of prostitution, therefore she does not sell her sexual favors
8. Mangum is an innocent mother of three (that's partially true....guess which part....)
9. Mangum wrote the summer motions; I just delivered them
10. the truth will set her free....

Anonymous said...

fyi, spousal domestic violence victims rarely have a history of violence themselves, i.e., they rarely commit acts of violence....except on occasion when they "snap" and murder their spousal attackers or cut off their attacker's private parts. Mangum has a documented history of violence toward both property and persons. Spousal domestic violence victims typically are in long term relationships. Mangum had only been shacked up with Daye for a short period.
There is nothing about the Daye killing, at all, that supports the notion of self defense, based on the evidence. There is not one shred of evidence that supports Mangum's claim that she was beaten and choked.....other than her apparent "story". Harr has yet to produce the much touted photos that show this awful beating. Now we are led to believe there was another beating......again, with photos. No such evidence has been produced. It makes absolutely no sense that mangum would never reveal, for more than a year, that she had been the victim of a prior beating. THAT is nonsense.
Mangum has a court date this week. Let's see what happens in this melodrama....

kenhyderal said...

Guiowen said : "Have you no shame? Mocking a kindly old man because of a spelling mistake?" Shades of Claude Raines; Guiowen is shocked, shocked that mockery is going on here. Ask Dr. Harr if he took offence at my spoof. I'm sure he got a laugh out of own mistake and took my response in good fun. Certainly if he is offended I apologize to him

guiowen said...

Kenhyderal said,
"Guiowen is shocked, shocked that mockery is going on here."

Around here, the only one we mock is the guy who claims he wants to help his bosom buddy, but can't take the time to do it. What are you, an indentured servant or something?

Anonymous said...

why my goodness, guiowen, you must know how terribly busy canada-dubai is these days....what with all the googling he has to do...to look up quotes and all that cut-n-paste work. Just keeping track of Malek is a full time job.....much less all his pontificating about Mangum and her Mother of the Year Award.
Have pity on the poor man, guiowen......trolling is a pain in the fanny.

Anonymous said...

where IS Malek, not-my-slave-name, these days? Must be busy with helping Mangum.....perhaps just as busy as Kenny appears to be.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

"That was the "Man from Nazareth" himself;"

John 10:30: I and the Father are one.

"however, you have to take it in context because in several other instances he, himself, called unbelievers fools"

From Matthew 5:22: But anyone who says, 'You fool!' will be in danger of the fire of hell.

That is pretty unequivocal. And you did not point that out when you quoted 'But anyone who says, 'You fool!' will be in danger of the fire of hell to someone you did not like. That makes you a hypocrite.

Further, you are equating blatant unrepentant liar SIDNEY Harr with the way, the TRUTH and the life. I think that rises to the level of blasphemy.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

"Anonymous Said: "the Father of the Man from Nazareth considered it a major offense to call someone a fool"......... That was the "Man from Nazareth" himself; however, you have to take it in context because in several other instances he, himself, called unbelievers fools".

There is overwhelming evidence that Crystal was not raped on the night of 13/14 March 2006. You do not believe in that evidence. By your own words, via the Man from Nazareth, you name yourself a fool.

kenhyderal said...

Anonymous said: "By your own words, via the Man from Nazareth, you name yourself a fool".......... Boy,are you missing the message.

kenhyderal said...

Guiowen said: "Around here, the only one we mock is the guy who claims he wants to help his bosom buddy, but can't take the time to do it. What are you, an indentured servant or something"........."Have you stopped mocking Dr.Harr, then? No, I am simply a hard "working stiff" with family responsibilities. I'll do whatever I can, though, for my friend, Crystal.

kenhyderal said...

Anonymous @ 7:34 said: "Paine wrote The Age of Reason and he absolutely blistered christian doctrine in it................ Paine was a Deist but one who rejected the Deity of Jesus and his miracles. He did not reject his teachings. He also questioned biblical revelation as being Creator inspired. And, Mr. Anonymous, how would you caracterize yourself? Perhaps you wish to conceal your anti-Christianity.

guiowen said...

kenhyderal said...

"Have you stopped mocking Dr.Harr, then? No, I am simply a hard "working stiff" with family responsibilities. I'll do whatever I can, though, for my friend, Crystal."

a. I don't mock my friends -- I merely am prodding Sidney to do something.
b. I see, when push comes to shove, you suddenly find other things to do than help Crystal

November 12, 2012 1:29 PM

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

"Anonymous said: "By your own words, via the Man from Nazareth, you name yourself a fool".......... Boy,are you missing the message."

No, boy have YOU really missed the message.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

"No, I am simply a hard "working stiff" with family responsibilities. I'll do whatever I can, though, for my friend, Crystal."

Even if, by helping your friend, it means condemning innocent men to prison based on Crystal's false allegations.

guiowen said...

kenhyderal said...

" I am simply a hard "working stiff" with family responsibilities."

Yes, I guess it's probably better not to tell your family about Crystal. Is that what you mean by "responsibilities"?

Anonymous said...

What makes you think I am a "he" , Kenny? What an ass you are.......and a pompous one at that. You bet I am anti Christianity if it means the likes of you and Harr and Fred Phelps and Jeremiah Wright and Jesse Jackson and any other hypocritical self righteous bigot.....like the infamous Harr club member, Peterson. Christianity, my left hind foot. If these people are Christians, then I thank the good lord I am not

Anonymous said...

You don't know squat about Paine. He completely rejected Jesus' teachings about love, revelation, sin and the infallibility of god. Stop googling Wikipedia, Kenny. Your ignorance is showing..... Paine was so much a deist that he wound up not even being buried in consecrated ground and vilified by Christians. And you quote him here,in between harr's man from glad speeches. Hilarious.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

"Paine was a Deist but one who rejected the Deity of Jesus and his miracles. He did not reject his teachings."

Why do you quote scripture and then reject what is in scripture.

You advocate convicting innocent men and casting them into prison for decades, all for a crime which never happened.

You can call Crystal the victim of a violent sexual assault, but you have shown yourself incapable of giving any evidence, material, factual, circumstantial or otherwise that the crime happened.

kenhyderal said...

Ms.Anonymous said" :What makes you think I am a "he" , Kenny"....... My apologies Ma'am

kenhyderal said...

Anonymous said: "You don't know squat about Paine" .......No more than the average man but hey, why should that prevent me from quoting him about "suspicion"? I do know he was an early anti-slavery advocate. I have been to his cottage in New Rochelle N.Y. I really should read his biography by Craig Nelson who also wrote about the WW2 airman Jimmy Doolittle.

kenhyderal said...

Guiowen said: "Yes, I guess it's probably better not to tell your family about Crystal. Is that what you mean by "responsibilities"... I have nothing to hide from my family.

kenhyderal said...

Anonymous @ 5:32 said: " Jesus was born in Bethlehem. He was not from Nazereth" He spent most of his life in Nazareth and he was known as Jesus of Nazareth and also as Jesus the Nazarene

kenhyderal said...

Ms.Anonymous said: "then I thank the good lord I am not"....... Do I detect an oxymoron here? Like you, Ma'am, Fred Phelps is certainly not, in my opinion, a Christian

kenhyderal said...

Anonymous @ 11:58 said: " There is overwhelming evidence that Crystal was not raped on the night of 13/14 March 2006. You do not believe in that evidence. By your own words, via the Man from Nazareth, you name yourself a fool"........... No, Jesus said those who do not believe in The Almighty are fools. He had nothing to say about someone who doubts the truth of slanted evidence.

Anonymous said...

So now you think I am a woman, hence the Ms Anon clever title. wow, such a smart fellow. Your misuse of the term oxymoron is comical, too. I recently saw a wonderful bumper sticker, It read, "WWJD?"...Jesus would slap the shit outta you...."
I don't find it necessary to invoke man from glaaaad reprimands like harr does.....his hypocrisy in spouting religious dribble while he hangs out with the queen of bigots is .....well.....is just, to say the least, typical of a man who would call a dead man an alcoholic....without one bit of evidence to support such a claim.
You say you are a friend to Mangum. Act, then, Kenny.....your words mean nothing.

Anonymous said...

A true friend to Mangum would:
Tell her to avoid Harr and his club like the plague
Tell her to get and KEEP a lawyer, not a lunatic, for counsel.
Tell her to admit that she lied about the 2006 rapes and that she wants to apologize to all those who were hurt by her lies
Tell her to take full responsibility for her choices and stop blaming everybody else for her problems
Tell her to clean up her life and her body....no drugs, no booze and no selling sex

that, my friend, is what a REAL friend to Mangum would do

Anonymous said...

Isn't this a Mangum court date? didn't the NC Bar committee determine to file an action against Harr? Aren't we promised photos that have yet to materialize?

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

"Ms.Anonymous said: "then I thank the good lord I am not"....... Do I detect an oxymoron here? Like you, Ma'am, Fred Phelps is certainly not, in my opinion, a Christian "

Your opinion aside, your advocacy of the conviction of innocent men of a non existent crime simply because you do not believe the crime was non existent would endear you to Fred Phelps. Your thinking is pure Fred Phelps.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

"No, Jesus said those who do not believe in The Almighty are fools. He had nothing to say about someone who doubts the truth of slanted evidence."

You are one who doubts the truth of overwhelming valid evidence, evidence that Crystal was not raped. That would not endear you to Jesus Christ as a seeker of truth.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

I again issue a challenge, a challenge which you have repeatedly dodged in the past. Without dragging in irrelevant red herrings, present objective evidence that Crystal was raped.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

"Fred Phelps is certainly not, in my opinion, a Christian".

In your opinion, overwhelming objective evidence that Crystal was not raped is slanted, simply because you believe she was.

I am no admirer of Fred Phelps, but you have shown that your opinions are the product of some unreasonable guilt presuming bias. That puts you on the same level as Fred Phelps.

Anonymous said...

Well, any moment now I am expecting Harr to climb up on his ponitification throne and blast us all with another installment of "white people are evil and here's why". Guess what? The awful terrible hateful very bad racist women's LAX team at Duke is PROVEN to be the nastiest most horrible most black-hating most despicable group on the planet. And why, you say? Well, one of the women wore blackface to a LAX women's halowenn party when she dressed up as Buckwheat....part of a Little Rascals theme. A picture got posted on GoDUKE, which was immediately taken down and the coach/ team issued an apology. so, I am absolutely certain we will now hear how this PROVES the entire athletics program at Duke is racist, that Mangum was gang raped, that all white athletes are corrupt rich little bastards and bastettes and that god is going to smite them all.
I have NO argument that putting on blackface is dumb and insensitive. However, the metanarrative from the evil white oppressor crowd will begin shortly and will scream that this single act, by a single player does, in fact, PROVE that the entire white culture, on the entire planet is satanic in its racist underpinnings.
A silly dumb girl did a silly dumb thing.....for which she has apologized. But, dear lord, here comes the whine-n-cheese crowd.

Anonymous said...

One more comment about the duke lax blackface incident. How about we give equal time and attention to the countless rude gross insensitive obscene and filthy black music crap that blasts out of car speakers in public places....filling our ears and the ears of children..... if we are going to crucify this woman because she wore blackface, then lets' have an equally viscious condemnation of the contamination of our air by the lyrics that we are forced to endure.....that include language so crude it cannot be repeated on this site. Stupidity and racially insensitive acts are carried out, daily, by people of ALL races. To say otherwise is, in and of itself, the height of racism.

Anonymous said...

Fred Phelps condemns an entire group of people, invokes god, provides no evidence other than "I say so". and thinks he is above the law. sound familiar, bro?

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

Your litmus for slanted evidence is whether or not it supports your blatant unrepentant racist presumption that innocent Caucasian men are guilty of raping Crystal.

Anonymous said...

I was with a friend, riding in her car, a few weeks ago. Windows down, enjoying the day. A car pulled up by us at a light, radio absolutely blaring...bass loud enough to vibrate teeth. The filth coming out of that car was beyond description.....I will not use the exact words, but here's a little bit....bleep the white bleep up the bleep, kick the cracker cop's bleep till he scream, bleep em all, the white bleepin' bleeps, the c's bleep be nothin but a bleep. I get and support the imperative for free speech....but our courts have clearly placed limits on speech that is pornographic, threatens violence, and "racially insensitive". At the very least, this is noise pollution....much less racially obnoxious.
I dare say that if a red neck cowboy in a pickup truck, playing "music" at 300 decibels, was shouting lyrics like "bleep the black bleep, kick the bleepin bleep up his bleep, the black bleep's bleep aint nothing but bleep"........the PC police, the NAACP and the entire Afro American studies department at Duke would have a meltdown!
What somebody chooses to contaminate their own minds and heads with is their business....but when I am forced to listen to racial obscenity, it's an entirely different matter.
Perhaps we would all be able to discuss the Mangum case with less rancor if people like Harr were equally strident in their condemnation of racist acts on the part of all people, not just white folks.

Nifong Supporter said...


Anonymous said...
Isn't this a Mangum court date? didn't the NC Bar committee determine to file an action against Harr? Aren't we promised photos that have yet to materialize?


Mangum's next court date is Thursday, November 15, 2012. Supposedly the prosecution will set a trial date.

The State Bar is supposedly in the process of drafting a complaint against me... an injunction preventing me from filing in Mangum's case. To date, I have not received anything from the Bar regarding it.

Regarding photos, I will release a couple in a few minutes by way of a link in a comment to follow shortly.

Nifong Supporter said...


HEY!! LISTEN UP, EVERYBODY!
Important Links... and I'm not talking sausage!

As you should know, When Crystal Mangum sought refuge in the bathroom and locked the door, Reginald Daye busted it down.

Now, for the first time online, the photographs taken that show that damaged door... just go to the two links provided below. The first will show the door frame separated from the jamb and the indentation in the door, and the second will be a close up view.

LINK ONE:
Door and frame damage

LINK TWO:
Frame-jamb close-up

Nifong Supporter said...


Anonymous said...
SIDNEY HARR:

The Man from Nazareth, who spoke the words, Father forgive them for they know not what they do, did not call the people, for whom He prayed, fools.

And you have the nerve to call yourself as a follower of the Man from Nazareth.


He may not have said it, but He probably thought it.

Anonymous said...

You have repeatedly said Daye KICKED the door in. that blow is not a kick unless he was pretty good at karate. too, these photos prove absolutely nothing.
1. when was the damage done? unknown
2. by whom? unknown
3. for what reason? unknown
4. no evidence to prove that the door off its frame happened at the same time as the apparent damage to the door itself.
5. these photos don't look like LE investigative photos. where did you get them and where is the time stamp?
Mangum is going to have to PROVE that it was Daye, damaging the door, that night,etc......and then, she is going to have the PROVE that the damage to the door was somehow directly related her claim of self defense in killing him.

Anonymous said...

the photos do prove one thing....the door has sustained damage, at some point, by some means, for some reason. that's all these photos demonstrate.

Anonymous said...

I do part time construction work....It is highly unlikely that single blow to a point on the door itself, a few inches above the doorknob, would actually dislodge an entire door FRAME. If you look closely at the photo, you see that the frame intself, from the top ONLY, is moved inward. That kind of damage would be very unlikely to come from a blow to what is obviously a hollow-core door, made of weaker material than a frame. The hinges are intact. To knock an entire frame inward, you would expect a damage to the frame itself, upward near the point where the frame has been moved inward. very hard to believe what mangum is claiming, based on these two photos.
we have said, all along that first degree murder as unlikely, but I don't see much here to support her claim of self defense altogether.

Anonymous said...

so, Harr, where did these photos comes from? No time stamp is visible. Crime scene photos are always time stamped and, usually, if there is specific damage or evidence to be depicted, there is a mark or designation on the photo itself. For example, tagged blood spatter or bullet holes are usually marked. I see no investigative marks. Are you now saying that you got these photos directly from the prosecution? From Mangum? You told us previously that there were photos, but that Mangum was told she could not have them till she got out of jail. Was that a lie? Are you now admitting you lied?

Anonymous said...

why is there no extreme closeup of the damage to the door above the doorknob? one would think, if these were LE investigative photos, that such a closeup shot, time stamped, with a reverse photo of the damage, inflicted from the outside, and coming through to the interior, would also be shown. One would also think the prosecution would be looking for DNA evidence on the damage to the door....

Anonymous said...

So, now you presume to know the mind of God?

We can now add Theology to the growing list of things you do not comprehend.

Try reading your Bible (if you even have one) -- 1 Corinthians 2:11, just to get you started...

Lance the Intern said...

These are not investigative photos. In all likelihood, they will not be allowed as evidence.

Anonymous said...

Lance, they sure don't look like any investigative photos I have ever seen.

guiowen said...

Sidney,
I wish you would take my advice. I specifically asked you to get time-stamped photos. Without the time stamp, none of these naysayers will believe you.
I think Kenhyderal will believe you, but unless he comes to Durham there's nothing he can do to help. Apparently his family is much more important than getting Crystal out of gaol (jail). Worse yet, he thinks that actually asking you to do something specific is bullying you, so he won't even give you any advice.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

"
The Man from Nazareth, who spoke the words, Father forgive them for they know not what they do, did not call the people, for whom He prayed, fools.

And you have the nerve to call yourself as a follower of the Man from Nazareth.


He may not have said it, but He probably thought it."

You show you are anything but a follower of the Man from Nazareth. You are a blasphemer.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

Where is the time and date information. Without that information those pictures mean nothing. There is no documentation they are evidentiary photos taken by the Durham Police. We do not know if they are pictures of Reginald Daye's apartment. We have only your word and your word is extremely unreliable.

Anonymous said...

These photos, if not, in fact, taken by the LE investigation, and held in custody as such, are being misrepresented on this web site as evidence. They would not be admissible. Without a time stamp and other documentation, these photos are meaningless. More bullhockey and nonsense.....

Anonymous said...

I hope sidney harr is not so ignorant and silly as to think these photos would actually be admissible in court. They would not. What kind of fool is Harr becoming? Is he being hoodwinked by Mangum into believing that these photos have significance? Did he gain admission to the Daye apartment and take these himself? Are these even taken in Daye's old apartment? Does Harr really think people are that gullible that mangum could go into court and prove something with these pictures? No way, folks, and a waste of time.

Anonymous said...

" Now, for the first time, on the big screen, in living color....TAAADAAAA"!!! Photos....uh, that mean zip.

Anonymous said...

"Anonymous said...

I hope sidney harr is not so ignorant and silly as to think these photos would actually be admissible in court. They would not. What kind of fool is Harr becoming?"

SIDNEY HARR has become someone who now thinks he speaks for Jesus Christ on the cross.

Anonymous said...

Walt, seen these photos? What do you think? Admissible?

Anonymous said...

Maybe it is wrong to refer to SIDNEY as a fool. However it is obvious he is decompensating. He, as I have already said, presumes to speak for Jesus Christ on the cross(KENHYDERAL, your take on this?). He posts photos which he has not documented are photos of Reginald Daye's apartment but proclaims them evidence that Crystal was beaten by Mr. Daye.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

"Anonymous @ 5:32 said: ' Jesus was born in Bethlehem. He was not from Nazereth' He spent most of his life in Nazareth and he was known as Jesus of Nazareth and also as Jesus the Nazarene".

How does that exonerate SIDNEY from calling someone a fool, or presuming to speak for Jesus Christ on the cross?

Anonymous said...

I guess the point here is that references to Jesus , as made by Harr, when he gets cornered with his lies, are really silly....coming from a racist and a hypocrite. We al know what you are doing, Sidney.......a pig in a prom dress is still, well, still a pig.

Anonymous said...

Sidney, what are you doing? You know damn well these photos are not admissible and are not LE investigative photos. What are you trying to pull? This is embarrassing for you.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

"Anonymous @ 11:58 said: " There is overwhelming evidence that Crystal was not raped on the night of 13/14 March 2006. You do not believe in that evidence. By your own words, via the Man from Nazareth, you name yourself a fool"........... No, Jesus said those who do not believe in The Almighty are fools. He had nothing to say about someone who doubts the truth of slanted evidence. "

You are not someone who doubts the truth of slanted evidence. You are someone who doubts the truth.

Anonymous said...

please take notice that sidney harr refuses to admit that he has lied about many specific postings on this flop site. HIs lies has been identified, called out, and he has been cowardly in his refusal to either admit that he lied or to offer any explanation other than lame excuses or sideways finger point. (an example is his lie blaming the LEO for setting fire to Walker's clothes, then.....when confronted with his lie.....he did not admit to it or apologize, but went on a rant about the officer's decision to call the FD)
Sidney Harr is a liar and, with this latest false photo posting, his lies continue to multiply.

guiowen said...

Do you see, Sidney, what happens when you don't take my advice? Without the time stamp, these photographs won't convince anyone.

kenhyderal said...

Anonymous @ 7:10 said:"the photos do prove one thing....the door has sustained damage, at some point, by some means, for some reason. that's all these photos demonstrate".......... "Skepticism is the sadism of embittered souls"..Emile M Cioran. Don't worry Dr.Harr they wont be skeptical for long

kenhyderal said...

Anonymous @ 4:15 said: "So now you think I am a woman, hence the Ms Anon clever title. wow, such a smart fellow. Your misuse of the term oxymoron is comical, too" ...... First you say " what makes you think I am a he Kenny?" ; which caused me to conclude you were a "she" now you say "so now you think I am a woman". I guess the best spin I can place on it is that you wish to conceal your gender. Educate me; when you say "I thank the Lord I'm not a Christian", although more subtle then cold fire it has the ring of an oxymoron to me. But then maybe it was Lord Krishna you were thanking.

guiowen said...

"Skepticism is the sadism of embittered souls"

Whereas happy souls believe anything you tell them.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

"Anonymous @ 7:10 said:"the photos do prove one thing....the door has sustained damage, at some point, by some means, for some reason. that's all these photos demonstrate".......... "Skepticism is the sadism of embittered souls"..Emile M Cioran. Don't worry Dr.Harr they wont be skeptical for long".

Why are you skeptical of the overwhelming factual evidence that Crystal was not raped?

The Cioran quote is not at all relevant to the fact that Sidney's photos can not be proven to be of Reginald Daye's apartment.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDEFAL:

"Anonymous @ 7:10 said:"the photos do prove one thing....the door has sustained damage, at some point, by some means, for some reason. that's all these photos demonstrate".......... "Skepticism is the sadism of embittered souls"..Emile M Cioran. Don't worry Dr.Harr they wont be skeptical for long".

Why is SIDNEY so skeptical about the overwhelming factual evidence that Crystal was not raped. SIDNEY(and you) must be really sadistically embittered.

Anonymous said...

Kenny, dear, my gender is, indeed, unimportant. YOU, skippy, made an assumption that I am male, and it was that assumption, itself, that I pointed out to you....you OFTEN make assumptions...which, at times, turn out to be both false and embarrassing to you.
As to my personal spiritual life, it is NONE of your business. got it, chief. What I said, pal, was that I have no desire to be a christian IF it means being christian like Phelps, Jackson, Falwell, Jeremiah Wright and countless others who are flaming hypocrites.....and who have inflicted tremendous hurt, in the name of jesus. Your buddy, harr, hangs out with the notorious bigot in residence, the psuedo christian victoria peterson. I suggest you and harr spend some time looking in the mirror before you concern yourself with the spiritual welfare of others.
stay happy in sandland, or wherever you are......

Anonymous said...

ok, sidney, still waiting for the big reveal.....tick tick tick

Lance the Intern said...

Anonymous at 7:10 ':"the photos do prove one thing....the door has sustained damage, at some point, by some means, for some reason. that's all these photos demonstrate"
Kenhyderal @9:21:
" 'Skepticism is the sadism of embittered souls'..Emile M Cioran. Don't worry Dr.Harr they wont be skeptical for long"

Per your favorite source (Wikipedia),"skepticism" is "generally any questioning attitude towards knowledge, facts, or opinions/beliefs stated as facts, or doubt regarding claims that are taken for granted elsewhere."

Anonymous clearly identified the FACTS that these pictures prove, with no questionable attitude. Therefore your claims of skepticism are unwarranted.

Try again, troll.

Nifong Supporter said...


Anonymous said...
You have repeatedly said Daye KICKED the door in. that blow is not a kick unless he was pretty good at karate. too, these photos prove absolutely nothing.
1. when was the damage done? unknown
2. by whom? unknown
3. for what reason? unknown
4. no evidence to prove that the door off its frame happened at the same time as the apparent damage to the door itself.
5. these photos don't look like LE investigative photos. where did you get them and where is the time stamp?
Mangum is going to have to PROVE that it was Daye, damaging the door, that night,etc......and then, she is going to have the PROVE that the damage to the door was somehow directly related her claim of self defense in killing him.


Dear Disbeliever,
Daye admits in police interviews to busting down the door. Although he said he "kicked" it in, I'm sure that he most likely used his shoulder.

Nifong Supporter said...


Anonymous said...
I do part time construction work....It is highly unlikely that single blow to a point on the door itself, a few inches above the doorknob, would actually dislodge an entire door FRAME. If you look closely at the photo, you see that the frame intself, from the top ONLY, is moved inward. That kind of damage would be very unlikely to come from a blow to what is obviously a hollow-core door, made of weaker material than a frame. The hinges are intact. To knock an entire frame inward, you would expect a damage to the frame itself, upward near the point where the frame has been moved inward. very hard to believe what mangum is claiming, based on these two photos.
we have said, all along that first degree murder as unlikely, but I don't see much here to support her claim of self defense altogether.


What have we here...? A door frame conspiracy theorist?

Not to make light, I am really appreciative of your analytical contribution. Thank you.

Nifong Supporter said...


Anonymous said...
so, Harr, where did these photos comes from? No time stamp is visible. Crime scene photos are always time stamped and, usually, if there is specific damage or evidence to be depicted, there is a mark or designation on the photo itself. For example, tagged blood spatter or bullet holes are usually marked. I see no investigative marks. Are you now saying that you got these photos directly from the prosecution? From Mangum? You told us previously that there were photos, but that Mangum was told she could not have them till she got out of jail. Was that a lie? Are you now admitting you lied?


First, I picked up the prosecution from the Durham Detention Center where Mangum requested that I have them.
Second, the photos may not have time stamps on them, but the file names of each photo contain the date and time the photo was taken, along with the type of camera. So there is a way to tell precisely when the photos were taken.
Thirdly, I have not lied, and therefore am not admitting that I lied, for if I did I would be lying.

Nifong Supporter said...


Lance the Intern said...
These are not investigative photos. In all likelihood, they will not be allowed as evidence.


Intern and disbeliever,
Hold on to your derby. Further photos will be presented, including identifying markers, etc. However, like I stated, the date and time are titled in the file of each photo, so a time stamp would only be redundant. Time stamps on photos, is probably a thing of the past with digital photographs in use.

Nifong Supporter said...


Anonymous said...
"Anonymous said...

I hope sidney harr is not so ignorant and silly as to think these photos would actually be admissible in court. They would not. What kind of fool is Harr becoming?"

SIDNEY HARR has become someone who now thinks he speaks for Jesus Christ on the cross.


Anonymi, ill-willers, and disbelievers,
Answer me this: If I did not get the photos of the damaged door from prosecution discovery, where did I get them?

Nifong Supporter said...


kenhyderal said...
Anonymous @ 7:10 said:"the photos do prove one thing....the door has sustained damage, at some point, by some means, for some reason. that's all these photos demonstrate".......... "Skepticism is the sadism of embittered souls"..Emile M Cioran. Don't worry Dr.Harr they wont be skeptical for long


Hey, Kenhyderal.

Your comment and quote was so enlightening that it bears repeating:

kenhyderal said...
Anonymous @ 7:10 said:"the photos do prove one thing....the door has sustained damage, at some point, by some means, for some reason. that's all these photos demonstrate".......... "Skepticism is the sadism of embittered souls"..Emile M Cioran. Don't worry Dr.Harr they wont be skeptical for long



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