Wednesday, July 24, 2013

Man in a Red Jumpsuit – Shan Edward Carter: A case for repeal of the death penalty in North Carolina


Word count: 538

(LINK to flog follows the comments below.)

In light of the recent “stand your ground self defense” acquittal of self-appointed vigilante George Zimmerman of Sanford, Florida, the capital conviction of Wilmington, North Carolina’s Shan Edward Carter takes on added significance. During the months of January and February 1997, word on the streets of the coastal city was that drug dealer Tyrone Baker was looking for those responsible for stealing from his apartment $40,000 in cash of his ill gotten gains. He openly expressed his intentions of terminating those responsible.

Damont “Eli” White, one of the trio of burglars responsible for pilfering Baker’s stash, was kidnapped off the street in broad daylight by Baker and later pistol-whipped to gain information about the others involved. Shan Carter, a small-time burglar and drug dealer whose crimes were committed while unarmed, and Kwada Temoney, who had a violent criminal past that included an armed bank robbery in which he fired his weapon, were White’s other two accomplices in the Baker heist.

When Tyrone Baker finally caught up with Carter and Temoney on a street corner dealing drugs, he flattened Temoney with a sucker punch, and walked toward Carter with his gun-hand concealed by a heavy coat draped over it. In fear for his life, Carter fired his gun twice with the intention of wounding him… and as Baker turned and retreated, Carter fired three additional rounds to keep Baker motivated and occupied with escape. Not intentionally trying to strike the fleeing man, one of the bullets ricocheted off the steering wheel of a parked car striking an 8 year-old boy in the head (he later died). It was hours later before Carter even was aware that he had struck the boy with his gunfire.

The accidental death of the young boy and the self-defense death of the drug dealer Baker are convictions upon which Shan Carter received death sentences. The North Carolina prosecutors, from outspoken Hanover County Senator Thom Goolsby’s district, are trying to put to death the African American who is innocent of the commission of a capital crime.

The following flog (which was produced more than a year ago) contains the prologue to Shan Carter’s story which will be presented in subsequent chapters on this blog site.

I have been working Carter’s case for nearly three years, however, my advocacy on his behalf was interrupted to help assist Duke Lacrosse victim/accuser Crystal Mangum in the serious trumped up charges against her. As her case winds down toward its conclusion, I will be presenting more about Mr. Carter’s case.


NOTICE: I am considering discontinuing the flogazine format as its files are excessively large… as more articles are added. If there is a large outpouring of those in favor of it, let me know and give it additional thought. Also, since I have been working nonstop on Mangum’s case since 2011, I will take a brief respite for a couple of weeks before heading down the homestretch with her scheduled trial in mid-November 2013. I anticipate my next posting on this blog site to be the mid to late part of August 2013.



Click on panel below to access flog.
Click on panel below to access Punish-O-meter

580 comments:

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Anonymous said...

Anonymous said...

We could care less how much you criticize NC. That is your choice. Have at it. who gives a rip. You just might be happier in the frozen north or in some place where you would feel all warm and fuzzy and where you could spend hours each day spouting your opinions.....

July 29, 2013 at 12:23 PM

right, and at least 900 other people who just got arrested - plus a whole lot more that they represent would gladly join me at this point i am sure

you know, the ol fight or flight thing - you do get the opinion that they would rather everyone on medicad, medicare, unemployment, welfare, food stamps, and all school children and their teachers get the hell out of dodge so they can build their fracked up hog waste bio fuel centers as 'they' wish ... cuz they do not care ... because they are duke ... and good 'ol nc has it coming to them for the pain and suffering caused by the race-baiting 'them'

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

KENHYDERAL:

Check this out

http://newamericamedia.org/2013/07/when-racial-profiling-cuts-both-ways.php

It is a story written by a black man about how black people profile other races.

Anonymous said...

Dear fracked up hog waste......whatever you are trying to say, it would be perhaps helpful if you purchased Grammar and Punctuation for Dummies. Writing endless strings of words that make absolutely no sense, at all, is really not going assist you in making your numerous points. Buy the book. Oh, and read it.

Anonymous said...

perhaps in time

if you are so upset about me saying nc sucks - what are your thoughts on politics in nc for - say - the past 10 years or more?

nc is a truly beutiful state - it sits on some very very old quartz from an ancient land mass - it has NO wiggle room for fracking - as earthquakes are amplified through fracking liquids from earthquakes that occur even at great distances from the fracked land

nc is NOT a state that will do well with fracking

the hog farms - ever see what happens to nc during massive rain and hurricane events ???

get real

Sarcastic Anonymous2 said...

kennyhyderal,

I agree that you are not the only troll on this blog. You are, however, the most preeminent.

Your contributions to this blog are many:

1. The mystery rapist theory, supported by a second-hand anonymous source, any of Mangum's allegations not proven demonstrably false, the failure to match DNA found in Mangum and the failure of the DPD to conduct a real investigation. You steadfastly refuse to discuss the weaknesses in this preposterous theory when other posters foolishly raise objections.

2. Support of Mangum based on little more than her statements, with expressions of mock outrage when others criticize her.

3. The novel approach that each of Manfum's statements must be considered separately and must be taken as accurate unless one can prove with absolute certainty that the statement could not possibly be true. Critical statements, however, must be taken as false unless one can prove with absolute certainty that no other explanation is possible.

4. Completely extraneous comparisons between Canada and the US. This has provoked useless debate.

5. Academic drivel that holds that reverse racism is impossible, based on a re-definition of the word racism. This has provoked another useless debate.

6. Irrelevant bible verses and other quotations.

You successfully disrupt the few meaningful discussions that take place on this blog.

In all fairness, meaningful discussion on this blog is rare, due largely to the efforts of our host. With his inability to engage in honest debate, Sidney would be viewed as a troll on any other blog. As a result, other posters act like trolls.

Please accept my sincere apology. I did not intend to single you out as the only troll on this blog--only the most successful. Other posters (including myself) frequently take your bait. We should realize that any attempted debate with you is a complete waste of time.

All your accolades are well deserved.

Anonymous said...

I dunno, poster.......frackeduphogwaste is giving kenny hissy a pretty fair run for the title of "Troll of the Week". It used to be that Mistrail-recluse was in the running as well. Competition is good........

kenhyderal said...

Sarcastic Anonymous2 said: " You successfully disrupt the few meaningful discussions that take place on this blog"........... Which meaningful discussions are those? Posters on this blog are, in the main, fundamentalists who will not consider any viewpoint other then theirs ; that Crystal is a lying drug-addicted prostitute. This is absolutely wrong; that Trayvon Martin is a murderous thug; this is absolutely wrong that David Evans and George Zimmerman are above reproach; absolutely wrong. I disagree that comparing the relative justness of American and Canadian societies is extraneous. I know the unfavourable comparison is, hurtful to you but it's meant to goad you into desperately needed reforms

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

"Which meaningful discussions are those? Posters on this blog are, in the main, fundamentalists who will not consider any viewpoint other then theirs ; that Crystal is a lying drug-addicted prostitute. This is absolutely wrong; that Trayvon Martin is a murderous thug; this is absolutely wrong that David Evans and George Zimmerman are above reproach; absolutely wrong. I disagree that comparing the relative justness of American and Canadian societies is extraneous. I know the unfavourable comparison is, hurtful to you but it's meant to goad you into desperately needed reforms".

This latest screed of yours is but another collection of evidence that you are ignorant of facts because, as a blind, hypocritical, blatant unrepentant racist you choose to be.

Anonymous said...

give me a break

the trolls (ones who are always calling people trolls if their views clash with their own) are the ones who make the same lame complaints against those whom they label as trolls because they are too at loss for self control not to be trolled in the first place - and because they truly have nothing meaningful to add to the discussion except for their seemingly (to them) matched unworthy comment

it's ok sarcastic one - we'll all just be like you and keep poking at you over and over again for no apparent reason other than we choose to emmulate your thought provoking (not) posts against you ... just for the sheer delight in paying you the compliment that some say is the one that is often most esteemed

Anonymous said...

Here's an idea - a new NC game in the making:

Paying people to leave NC reality show

yeah - you could have votes every week - every day might work better for the amount of people who will want to play - say - 100 people a day

pay off all the nc linyings whom nc no longer wants to recgonize as legitamate citizens of the state with rights the same as any american to simply leave

there could be another option - kinda like door number two:

if you were actually convinced to stay in NC - what would that require?

the chooses:

jobs

a nonfracked up hog waste land

constitutional rights

a justice system that is not broken

a state government that is not broken

a health care system that is not broken

get rid of duke and their bush and co. corrupt croonies (that's being nice)

let federal programs work in nc - like unemployment benefits, etc.

i mean ... the companies they will attract to this state right now for increased jobs - people who set up shop thinking they can treat the nc people like slaves and get paid by the government to do it - would you actually WANT to work for them???

nc sucks

Anonymous said...

Door number three which is where most are stuck choosing at this time:

recognizing and absorbing the fact that:

a. that the us goverment is now them not us. And all you have is peaceful protest - and not even that.

b. the dems conditioned the people to trust government while letting the repubs corrupt them into using all citizens as part of a continual feeding into a system that is misinformed, continually in a state of destructive chaos producing 'reform', and made ill or killed at fancy or fear or folly - all so that the few can get richer and poor made even less educated and thus kept ignorant and willing guinia pigs to the system designed, manipulated, and slyly and cunningly packaged in a two party 'democratic' fracked up system of control, power, manipulation, and greed - because - to them - to the winner go the spoils of war - which is what they truly are - warmongering feardriving racebaiting men who like to play games

c. what the kicker is is that the entire thing gets orchastrated to revelations - you know - following the blue print - cuz - lord knows - you wouldn't want to actually change anything for fear of blashphemy against the ... wait ... what is the state religion supposed to be - didn't hear much on that one yet

Anonymous said...

dear fracked, add a book on spelling to your purchases......along with Hooked on Phonics. You must have graduated from that fine institution of higher learning, NCCU, that produced "no conscious Cline" and "I am not a criminal Crystal".....

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

"Posters on this blog are, in the main, fundamentalists who will not consider any viewpoint other then theirs ; that Crystal is a lying drug-addicted prostitute."

You give evidence against yourself that you choose to ignore facts. Crystal was a prostitute. Crystal did inappropriately use drugs. Crystal has lied, about being raped on the night of 13/14 March 2006, about what happened when she stole the taxi cab, about who set the fire which damaged Milton Walker's apartment.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

"I know the unfavourable comparison [of American and Canadian justice systems] is, hurtful to you but it's meant to goad you(us Americans) into desperately needed reforms".

Tat George Zimmerman was acquitted of murder in spite of pressure from the highest level to convict him, shows the good in the American Justice System.

Your idea of much needed reforms include a) innocent Caucasian men would have been convited of raping Crystal, even though there was overwhelming evidenceshe was not, and b) George Zimmerman would have been convicted of murdering Trayvon Martin, even though the evidence showed George Zimmerman fired at Trayvon when Trayvon was using deadly force on him.

Deadly force is defined as force which can cause death or serious injury. If you do not believe that pounding a man's head on a concrete sidewalk can kill or seriously injure a man, you are truly ignorant.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

Check this out:

http://atlantablackstar.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/sharptoncartoon.gif

If you really believe that race baiter al is a fighter for justice who never resorts to violence, check out what happened in Crown Heights and at Freddie's Fashion Mart.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

SIDNEY HARR:

from http://reason.com/blog/2013/07/02/prosecution-in-zimmerman-trial-continues

How evidence developed by the prosecution supports George Zimmermn's claim of self defense:

"Yesterday and today, the jurors in George Zimmerman's murder trial heard testimony from Chris Serino, the Sanford, Florida, police investigator who at one point recommended a manslaughter charge against him. Serino testified that he felt pressure from within the police department to make an arrest but that upon reflection he concluded there was not enough reason to doubt Zimmerman's account of the fight that ended in Trayvon Martin's death. While Zimmerman struck Serino as an overzealous neighborhood watch volunteer who unnecessarily set the stage for the confrontation with Martin, he also seemed to be telling the truth."

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

KENHYDERAL:

From http://reason.com/archives/2013/07/10/why-george-zimmerman-should-be-acquitted

"[Zimmerman] claims Martin, who was understandably angry about being followed, threw the first punch and was on top of him, knocking his head against a concrete sidewalk, when Zimmerman's HOLSTERED(emphasis added) gun became visible. Zimmerman says Martin seemed to be reaching for the gun, so he grabbed it first, fearing for his life, and shot Martin in the chest."

Anonymous said...

Anonymous said...

dear fracked, add a book on spelling to your purchases......along with Hooked on Phonics. You must have graduated from that fine institution of higher learning, NCCU, that produced "no conscious Cline" and "I am not a criminal Crystal".....

July 30, 2013 at 5:12 AM
seriously ... at least i talk about things other than devulging into the ol spell grammer bashing routine most are aware most don't give a hoot bout on-line

don't you ever do anything but troll people on this blog? got any original thoughts that don't involve bashing anyone (on this blog or in durham or not)???

quick - what would be behind door number four (no bashing - accept for nc politics - allowed)

Anonymous said...

what exactly does "devulging into" mean? Not familiar with that phrase......

Anonymous said...

Door Number four......???? Hmmmm, let's see........sidney and bathrobe boy playing Spades? Crystal and Kenny Hissy talking over old times? Carter making license plates? No conscious Cline attending community college English classes? Al Sharpton getting a fingerwave? Rev Jesse paying child support?

Anonymous said...

Oh, Canada....lalalala.......we don't got no eskimos!!!! Oh, Canada, we stand on guard for thee.....

Anonymous said...

Nominated for longest run-on non-sentence of the week!
The winner is.......TA DA!!!!!

"b. the dems conditioned the people to trust government while letting the repubs corrupt them into using all citizens as part of a continual feeding into a system that is misinformed, continually in a state of destructive chaos producing 'reform', and made ill or killed at fancy or fear or folly - all so that the few can get richer and poor made even less educated and thus kept ignorant and willing guinia pigs to the system designed, manipulated, and slyly and cunningly packaged in a two party 'democratic' fracked up system of control, power, manipulation, and greed - because - to them - to the winner go the spoils of war - which is what they truly are - warmongering feardriving racebaiting men who like to play games".....
Holy stream of consciousness thinking, poster.....

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

KENHYDERAL:

Check this out:

http://www.businessinsider.com/vincent-di-maio-says-martin-was-on-top-of-zimmerman-2013-7

A Forensic pathologist provides proof that Trayvon Martin was on top of George Zimmerman and had pounded George Zimmerman's head against the concrete.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

Check this out:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vincent_Di_Maio

"Dr. Vincent J. M. Di Maio is an American pathologist and a nationally renowned expert on the subject of gunshot wounds."

And

http://scaredmonkeys.com/2013/07/10/george-zimmerman-murder-trial-forensic-pathologist-dr-vincent-di-maio-testifies-that-trayvon-martin-was-on-top-of-zimmerman-when-teen-was-shot-2/

"Dr. Vincent Di Maio has an impeccable vitae and credentials."

Compare Dr. DiMaio's credentials to your lack thereof.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

KENHYDERAL:

Check this out:

http://dailycaller.com/2013/07/29/three-white-guys-beat-up-a-black-guy-in-dc-as-justiceforgeorge/

Then tell us what you think.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

KENHYDERAL:

Just for the fun of it, I googled the term, three white men beat up black man for George Zimmerman. I got 3.34 million hits in 0.36 seconds.

In the first 5 pages, I found 5 instances of black people attacking white people over the Zimmermn verdict. Then I found a separate article detailing multiple attacks by black people on white people. I found no actual instances of white people attacking black people.

A few urls:

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083_162-57595967-504083/this-is-for-trayvon-martin-d.c-police-say-white-man-was-attacked-by-three-black-men-invoking-name-of-slain-black-teen/

http://www.westernjournalism.com/defenseless-white-man-attacked-by-black-teens-dies/

http://godfatherpolitics.com/4586/why-isnt-the-attack-of-a-78-year-old-white-man-by-black-youths-a-hate-crime/

http://topconservativenews.com/2012/04/two-teens-beat-50-year-old-with-hammer-near-sanford-fl/

http://weaselzippers.us/2013/07/15/mississippi-white-man-beaten-by-three-black-men-in-retaliation-for-zimmerman-verdict-this-is-for-trayvon/

http://www.wnd.com/2012/05/wave-of-black-mobs-brutalizing-whites/

I say again, the search turned up NO accounts of white people beating black people.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

KENHYDERAL:

In thewake of the OJ simpson noot guilty of murder verict, were there white people going around beating u black people saying either, This is for Nicole Brown, or, This is for Ron Goldman?

There were a number of images of black groups cheering OJ for the verdict.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

KENHYDERAL:

Check this out:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2363939/White-people-kill-black-people-Stand-Your-Ground-states-354-likely-cleared-murder-Fresh-questions-self-defence-law-wake-Zimmerman-verdict.html

It is an example of how the mainstream media distorts the George Zimmerman verdict. The headline notes that white people who invoke stand your ground are more than 300 times more likely than blacks to be acquitted.

What the headline and the article DO NOT state is that George Zimmerman DID NOT invoke stand your ground.

Anonymous said...

Funny, I don't recall the President of the United States going on National TV, BEFORE a trial, and saying, "If I had a daughter, she would look just like Nicole". Nope, don't think so......
Oh, but, hey, there is no such thing as racism among black people , right? That's why the Florida blacks calling people in Florida, who are of mixed race (Hispanic and jewish) "spikes".....which is a black obscenity for "spic"and "kike". But, oh sure, NO black would be racist, right? And, of course, Farrakhan didn't stand up and say, "the jew boy " describing Zimmerman.

Nifong Supporter said...


Anonymous said...
SIDNEY HARR:

Hypothetical situation:

PJ Hairston, while tearing along I85 at 95mph, strikes and kills someone who is on the shoulder, say because that person's vehicle is disabled. PJ does not stop because he does not realize he struck someone.

Based on your distorted account of what Shan Carter did, you would say PJ was not guilty of a crime because he did not realize he had struck the person and had not intended to strike and kill that person in the first place.

Suppose it had been a white person driving at 93mph striking and killing a black person. Would you argue that white person, if he did not know he had struck another person and had not intended to do so, would not be guilty of a crime? I think not.


The shooting death of Tyrone Baker was self-defense and should not be considered a crime. The accidental death of the boy could possibly be considered to be some sort of manslaughter, but it definitely is not first degree capital murder.

Your hypotheticals I find to be a little too distant from Carter's situation... and I don't know what skin color has to do with it.

Nifong Supporter said...


Anonymous said...
SIDNEY HARR:

You call yourself "Nifong Supporter".

Yoy say you admire DA NIFONG's courage and ethics.

If so, being a Nifong supporter is like being an athletic supporter for a eunuch.


In my opinion, Mike Nifong is a wonderful person and the greatest district attorney the state of North Carolina will ever have. He has the courage, independence and integrity that makes him great.

Nifong Supporter said...


Anonymous Anonymous said...
The UNC basketball idiot, P. J. Hairstorn has been suspended indefinitely....THIS time for driving 93mph in a 60mph zone. OK, Harr, did the big bad evil white people make this creep drive like this, endangering others? Oh, of course, I guess the big bad evil white people faked his speeding, set him up and cited him falsely. Yep, sure, .........


So, all athletes who speed should be suspended from playing sports...? Is that your position?

My understanding is that Hairston was suspended because he received an impermissible benefit because someone rented a car for him.

The NCAA needs to be dissolved... it's nothing more than a useless parasite shamelessly feeding off the blood and sweat of college athletes.

Anonymous said...

isn't the kicker - if you want to get truly racist about the whole zimmerman/martin/obama thing - is that none of those people are actually white in the strictest sense of the word?

Nifong Supporter said...


Anonymous said...
SIDNEY HARR:

regarding the punishment-meter:

George Zimmerman was in a place in which he had a legal right to be. He was not performing any illegal activity. Specifically, there is no evidence he was stalking Trayvon Martin, no evidence he intended to kill Trayvon Martin. The killing happened after Trayvon Martin attacked him, using deadly force. Slamming a man's head against the concrete is deadly force.

Shan Carter was on the street dealing drugs and illegally in possession of a firearm. When he was confronted by tyrone Baker, he drew his firearm and fired at him. Tyrone Baker fled. Shan Carter pursued him, continued to fire at him and killed him. In the process, he killed an 8 year old boy who was not threatening him at all.

According to SIDNEY, George Zimmerman should have been convicted of murder. Shan Carter should have gotten off because he acted in self defense.

And SIDNEY tells the world he is a fighter for justice.

HUH!!!???


Zimmerman goaded Martin into a confrontation by profiling and stalking him. Martin was minding his own business and had every right to be in that community as did Zimmerman. Zimmerman is the one who was looking for trouble.

In Shan's case, drug dealer Tyrone Baker made it clear throughout the community of his intent to kill Carter, and he approached Carter (who was minding his own business selling drugs).

Keep in mind that only the first two shots Carter fired struck Baker, and the only reason he ran in the same direction as Baker was to secure an angle to prevent Baker from using the corner of a building from which to return fire.

Carter should not be charged with any crime in Baker's death!

Nifong Supporter said...


Anonymous Anonymous said...
Sidney,

For some reason, you were not able to respond to Break's comment. I have copied it below.


Sidney: That's true... and Trayvon Martin would be alive if George Zimmerman would not have profiled and stalked him.

That's true...

Zimmerman claimed he profiled Martin due to his behavior and dress in response to recent break-ins. Even if Zimmerman has profiled due to race (behavior to which Jesse Jackson has admitted), such activity is legal.

Zimmerman followed Martin to see where he was going. Your use of the word "stalking" is deliberately pejorative. Although the dispatcher told Zimmerman he didn't need to do that, such activity is legal.

...and Travon Martin would be alive if Travon Martin had not sucker punched Zimmerman, gotten on top of Zimmerman, continued to punch Zimmerman and slammed Zimmerman's head into the concrete sidewalk.


Police dispatch did not tell Zimmerman that "he didn't need to follow Martin," he told Zimmerman "not to follow" him.

Zimmerman made his report to police and should have left the gum-shoe detective work to the so-called professionals instead of trying to fancy himself as some kind of DeathWish vigilante.

Nifong Supporter said...


Anonymous said...
SIDNEY HARR:

Check this out:

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20090726180731AAutmiA:

"...some states aren't 'stand your ground' and they actually require that you flee from danger."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stand-your-ground_law:

North Carolina does not have a stand your ground law. When Tyrone Baker approached Shan Martin, Shan Martin's legal obligation was to flee, not open fire with an illegslly obtained weapon.

How's that for elucidation?


Whether or not North Carolina has a Stand Your Ground law or not, Shan Carter cannot outrun a bullet. Fleeing was not an option for Carter if he wanted to survive and he had every reason to believe that his life was in imminent danger. He acted legally when all facts are considered.

Anonymous said...

so why are the 'whites' getting blamed for what zimmerman or martin did since neither of them appear white?

Anonymous said...

sidney = dumb lawyer wannabe. Sidney = failed lawyer wannabe. Sidney = failed physician. Sidney = liar.....

Anonymous said...

the death penalty is not currently being carried out in nc - but not sure if there is a death row - and how those people are treated.

it is an interesting question that you pose about his penalty - but many people on this blog have pointed out issues of that case that would definetely take a trail, jury, judge, etc. to figure out and decide.

how do you propose to help him?
didn't the racial disparity death penalty law just get revoked? I did not see the results of that legislative action.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

"The shooting death of Tyrone Baker was self-defense and should not be considered a crime. The accidental death of the boy could possibly be considered to be some sort of manslaughter, but it definitely is not first degree capital murder."

What you imply by saying that is 1) Shan Martin, by breaking into Tyrone Baker's apartment and stealing tens of thousands of dollars, he did not provoke the confrontation, 2) When convicted felon Shan Carter was on the street carrying an illegal concealed firearm and dealing in illegal drugs, he was in a place where he had a legal right to be, 3) when he chased Tryone Martin and continued shooting at him he was in compliance with the law and 4) he should not be held criminally responsible for the death of Demetrius Greene because he had not intended to do it and did not know he had shot Demetrius Green. Consult Professor Coleman. That does not add up to self defense.

"Your hypotheticals I find to be a little too distant from Carter's situation... and I don't know what skin color has to do with it."

Which means you again are trying to C your racist A, quite ineffectually.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

"So, all athletes who speed should be suspended from playing sports...? Is that your position?"

Is it your position that an athlete going 93 mph in a 65mph is not putting himself and other people in danger?

"My understanding is that Hairston was suspended because he received an impermissible benefit because someone rented a car for him."

That means only that you do not understand.

"The NCAA needs to be dissolved... it's nothing more than a useless parasite shamelessly feeding off the blood and sweat of college athletes."

Did you at one time fail to make a collegiate athletic team? Hmmmm. Could that be why you resent the innocent, falsely accused Duke Lacrosse players?

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

"Zimmerman goaded Martin into a confrontation by profiling and stalking him. Martin was minding his own business and had every right to be in that community as did Zimmerman. Zimmerman is the one who was looking for trouble."

Evidence developed by the prosecution showed that was not so. Trayvon was the aggressor.

"In Shan's case, drug dealer Tyrone Baker made it clear throughout the community of his intent to kill Carter, and he approached Carter (who was minding his own business selling drugs)."

So you are again saying Shan Carter had no responsibility for provoking the confrontation(it would not have happened if Shan Carter had not broken and entered into Tyrone Baker's apartment with the intent to commit theft). You also argue that convicted felon was in a place where he had a legal right to be when he was on the street dealing in illegal drugs illegally carrying a concealed weapon. Your post suggests it is legal for a black man to deal drugs on the street. Another example of how you believe that when a black man commits a crime it is not a crime.

"Keep in mind that only the first two shots Carter fired struck Baker, and the only reason he ran in the same direction as Baker was to secure an angle to prevent Baker from using the corner of a building from which to return fire."

What you are saying is that when Tyrone Martin was mortally wounded and retreating Shan Carter was acting in self defense when he pursued and fired at Tyrone Baker. Records of the appeal say Shan Carter fired 4 to 6 shots at Tyrone Baker while Tyrone was retreating.

"Carter should not be charged with any crime in Baker's death!"

Yes he should have-Murder 1, felony murder, reckless endangerment, illegal possession of a firearm.

As I recall, in a previous post you did suggest Shan Carter should have been charged with manslaughter in the death of Demetrius Green.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

"[Shan Carter] was minding his own business selling drugs".

So selling illegal substances which have the capacity of seriously harming or killing other individuals for Shan Carter was simply minding his own business?

HUH!!!

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

"

Police dispatch did not tell Zimmerman that "he didn't need to follow Martin," he told Zimmerman "not to follow" him."

From the transcript of the 911 call, Dispatcher to George ZimmwemN when George Zimmerman said he was following Trayvon:

"Dispatcher

Ok, we don't need you to do that."

Sidney this is a bare faced lie on your part.

"Zimmerman made his report to police and should have left the gum-shoe detective work to the so-called professionals instead of trying to fancy himself as some kind of DeathWish vigilante."

Charles Bronson in the Death Wish movies always had his gun in hand when he stalked his victims. When George Zimmerman got out of his car he was carrying a flash light and a cell phone. That is not the act of a "DeathWish vigilante".

Regarding the gun, that came into play when Trayvon saw it holstered and tried to get his hands on it.

Again, you misrepresent and distort and then call it elucidation or enlightenment.

HAH!!!

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

"Whether or not North Carolina has a Stand Your Ground law or not, Shan Carter cannot outrun a bullet". Fleeing was not an option for Carter if he wanted to survive and he had every reason to believe that his life was in imminent danger."

What you obviously missed is that I admitted I was in error when I said NC did not have a stand your ground law. I said that Shan Carter was not obligated to flee. Unlike you, I admit my mistakes.

"He acted legally when all facts are considered."

Let's go over this again:

1) For it to be self defense, a person can not have provoked the confrontation. Shan Carter broke into Tyrone Baker's apartment and stole tens of thousands of dollars.

2) The person is in a place where he has a legal right to be. Shan Carter, a convicted felon, was on the street, dealing in illegal drugs and in illegal possession of a firearm.

3) When the assailant retreats, the assailed MUST cease the use of deadly force. If it is true that Tyrone Carter was hit twice when Shan Carter fired at him, then he was already mortally wounded when he retreated from the confrontation. Shan Carter pursued him and continued to fire at him. Again the record of the appeal states that Shan Carter fired 4 to 6 shots at Tyrone Baker while Tyrone Baker was retreating.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

Let's go over this again.

Check this out:

http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/ondcp/Fact_Sheets/consequences_of_illicit_drug_use.pdf

Illegal have killed literally tens of thousands of people over the past years.

You say that when Shan Carter was dealing harmful, potentially deadly substances to other people, he was, according to you, he was "only minding his business".

HUH!!!???

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

"In my opinion, Mike Nifong is a wonderful person and the greatest district attorney the state of North Carolina will ever have. He has the courage, independence and integrity that makes him great."

And you wonder why people do not put a lot of importance or credibility on your opinions.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

For your information, here is the the url for the transcript of the George Zimmerman 911 call:

http://misterbillohno.newsvine.com/_news/2013/07/10/19392176-transcript-of-george-zimmerman-911-call

Anonymous said...

he basically used the sheat out of ms. mangum with no regard for all black people and all americans and the world and the duke guys were made to take one for the gipper (although they did get paid well for their troubles)

Anonymous said...

Nifong? integrity? Eoooowwwe, I just threw up a little bit in my mouth......

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

http://misterbillohno.newsvine.com/_news/2013/07/10/19392176-transcript-of-george-zimmerman-911-call

The transcript does not contain a record of the dispatcher "told Zimmerman 'not to follow him'."

The words "not to follow him" never appear in the transcript of the 911 call.

You are trying to vilify George Zimmerman with outright lies. If George Zimmerman were really a death wish vigilante wannabe, why do you lie to prove your case?

Walt said...

Sid wrote: "Whether or not North Carolina has a Stand Your Ground law or not, Shan Carter cannot outrun a bullet. Fleeing was not an option for Carter if he wanted to survive and he had every reason to believe that his life was in imminent danger. He acted legally when all facts are considered."

The problem is Sid, Demitrius Greene was killed by Carter while Carter was pursuing Tyrone Baker. As I discussed above under North Carolina's transferred intent rule, that was Murder in the First Degree.

You can try all you want to dehumanize Demetrius. You can ignore all the law in the world to justify his murder. You can stick up for a drug dealing thug all you want. But the facts are the facts. Carter murdered Demetrius Greene.

Walt-in-Durham

Anonymous said...

Not only did Carter murder that little child, he did so by shooting a gun he was carrying illegally.....aiming at a man running away from him...while trying to carry out an act of dealing drugs. That's a hat trick for a scumbag like Carter......murder of a child, carrying a gun, dealing drugs......just about as low on the slime scale as you can get.
Had a little boy not lost his life on that day, I would have just as happy if both those pukes had shot and killed one another.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

"In my opinion, Mike Nifong is a wonderful person and the greatest district attorney the state of North Carolina will ever have. He has the courage, independence and integrity that makes him great."

I say this again. If you are a Nifong Supporter because of his "courage, independence and integrity", that is like being an athletic supporter for a eunuch.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Felony_murder_rule:

"The rule of felony murder is a legal doctrine in some common law jurisdictions that broadens the crime of murder in two ways. First, when an offender kills accidentally or without specific intent to kill in the commission of a felony, the offender can be charged with murder. Second, it makes any participant in such a felony criminally liable for any deaths that occur during or in furtherance of that felony."

from http://www.criminalattorneyusa.com/assault-with-a-deadly-weapon/

"Assault with a deadly weapon occurs when an individual assaults someone with a deadly weapon."

Shan Carter was committing felonies, possessing a gun illegally, firing that gun in a populated area, assault with a deadly weapon, possibly others. He killed Demetrius Green while he was committing those felonies. Whether or not he intended to kill Demetrius Green is irrelevant. Shan Carter murdered him.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

Regarding assault with a deadly weapon:

Shan Carter was pursuing and firing a gun at Tyrone Baker after Tyrone Baker had fled. That means Shan Carter's firing at Tyrone Baker at that point was not self defense. It was assault with a deadly weapon.

Or are you going to argue that when a black man fires a gun, the gun is not a deadly weapon? That is consistent with your philosophy that when a black man commits a crime, it was not a crime.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

"[Shan Carter] was minding his own business selling drugs".

Was Shan Carter just "minding his own business" when he broke into Tyrone Carter's apartment and stole $40,000?

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Is_there_a_self_defense_law_North_Carolina

"Is there a self defense law North Carolina?"

"Yes, there are several laws. North Carolina has a castle law which removes the duty to retreat before using lethal force in your own home or vehicle. Other than that, the duty to retreat does exist. You may not use lethal force against simple (unarmed) assault, YOU MAT NOT USE LETHAL FORCE IN A SITUATION WHICH YOU PROVOKED(emphasis added), you may only use lethal force in third party intervention when intervening on behalf of a party which would themselves have a legal right to self defence as defined under NC law. You may not use lethal force to protect property.

As you admit that Shan Carter broke into Tyrone Baker's apartment and robbed him of tens of thousands of dollars, how can you claim that Shan Carter did not provoke the confrontation?

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:


"[Shan Carter] was minding his own business selling drugs".

This implies, if a police officer had tried to arrest Shan Carter at that point, then Shan Carter could have shot him with his illegally possessed firearm and then pled self defense because he feared the officer might kill him.

Great thinking, SIDNEY>

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

Regarding Shan Carter, can you come up with any legal precedent which establishes that someone selling illegal drugs on the street while illegally in possession of a concealed firearm(a .357 magnum, a very powerful firearm) is just minding one's own business?

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

I bet you believe that if Shan Carter sold illegal drugs to someone who overdosed on them and died, he should be held not criminally responsible for the death because he sold the drugs without a specific intent to harm the individual.

You are arguing that Shan Carter should not be held criminally responsible for the death of Demetrius Green because, when he fired his illegally possessed powerful hand gun on a populated street, he had no intention to harm Demetrius Green.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

I bet, if someone had tried to rob Shan Carter while he was dealing illegal drugs, and Shan Carter had shot the would be robber with his illegally possessed .357 Magnum, you would argue that it would have been self defense. After all, according to you, when Shan Carter was selling illegal drugs while in illegal possession of a deadly weapon, he was just minding his own business.

What a unique perspective on the law you have.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

Check this out:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Felon_in_possession_of_a_firearm

"Being a felon in possession of a firearm is a felony in most U.S. states and in the federal system, per 18 U.S.C. § 922(g)"

Check this out:

http://www.ncga.state.nc.us/EnactedLegislation/Statutes/pdf/ByArticle/Chapter_14/Article_54A.pdf

A felon in North Carolina commits a felony by possessing a firearm(unless his right to possess a firearm is restored by the justice system).

Shan Carter was committing a felony by possessing a firearm. Regardless of the circumstances, if he fired his gun and killed someone, he would have killed that person while committing a felony.

In just about all jurisdictions, the felony murder rule would apply.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Felony_murder_rule

"...when an offender kills accidentally or without specific intent to kill in the commission of a felony, the offender can be charged with murder."

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

There is a story on the appropriately named Liestoppers about a fund raiser for rape hoaxer Tawana Brawley. Steven Pagones successfully sued her for defamation after she falsely accused him of raping her. He won a judgement of $190,000. She defaulted on the suit, then skipped town to Virginia and lived under an assumed name. The law caught up with her and ordered her wages garnished to pay the judgment. The benefit was to help her pay the judgment. My guess is she will keep the money raised and skip town again.

Race baiter al was instrumental in pushing the hoax. Google the name Perry McKinnon. You will get information that race baiter al, along with his cohorts maddox and mason, knew tawana and her family were pulling a hoax but pushed it anyway. Race baiter al has the resources to help tawana pay off the judgment. Is he doing so. No.

This is the race baiter al who you say always the right thing.

HUH!!!???

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARRian principles of equal justice for all:

1) If a black man does it, it is not a crime.

2) If a white man does it, it is a crime.

3) If a white man is falsely accused of a crime against a black person, the white man must be presumed guilty and convicted.

4) If a black man is inappropriately acquitted of murder 1, it is a cause of rejoicing and celebration.

5) If a white man is appropriately acquitted of murder 2, then the Department of Justice must look for a reason to charge him with a crime over the same incident and try and convict him, effectively negating the Constitutional protection against Double Jeopardy.

kenhyderal said...

Anonymous @ 8:01 said: "This is the race baiter al who you say always(does) the right thing"
.......... If Reverend Sharpton believed the allegation to be true and I have no reason to believe he did not, then, coming to the defence of Miss Brawley was the right thing to do.

Anonymous said...

Kenny is a troll.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

" If Reverend Sharpton believed the allegation to be true and I have no reason to believe he did not, then, coming to the defence of Miss Brawley was the right thing to do."

I say again, unless you choose to be blind and ignorant, google the name Perry McKinnon.

Race baiter al was aware at the beginning that the Brawleys were trying to promulgate a hoax.

Anonymous said...

Homer, Homer, Homer, Homer
Homer, Homer, Homer, Homer
Homer, Homer, Homer, Homer

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

I question how can you say race baiter sharpton never does the wrong thing. Your have shown on multiple occasions you can not tell the difference between right and wrong.

kenhyderal said...

Oh, I know the difference alright. For instance so much about the Justice System, there in North Carolina, with it's selective treatment based on class and race is wrong. So is it's denial of rights for the LGBT community; it's unfair administration of voting laws designed to discourage the vote of it's black and Hispanic citizens; it's war against women's reproductive autonomy. These are all things that Reverend Sharpton denounces.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

"Oh, I know the difference alright. For instance so much about the Justice System, there in North Carolina, with it's selective treatment based on class and race is wrong."

In other words you believe innocent Caucasian should have been convicted of raping Crystal, even though there was no evidence a rape had taken place.

"So is it's denial of rights for the LGBT community;"

When has race baitr al ever stood up for the lgbt community? He may have made statements to support Mr. Obama's position but he eas neve rvadvocated for ay rights. He advocates only for black on white racism."

"it's unfair administration of voting laws designed to discourage the vote of it's black and Hispanic citizens;"

According to you it is wrong to create minority dominated districts in order to insure minority representation in government. As was been pointed out to you, that was the impetus for redistricting in NC.

"it's war against women's reproductive autonomy."

According to recent Google search, race baiter sharpton does not advocate very vigorously for women's reprodctive rights.

"These are all things that Reverend Sharpton denounces."

Race baiter al also denounces the jury which appropriately acquitted George Zimmerman. Race baiter al refuses to acknowledge tawana was a hoax. Race baiter al does not denounce black on white racism. He advocates for it.

kenhyderal said...

http://thegrio.com/2013/03/27/rev-al-sharpton-on-gay-marriage-debate-equality-includes-everyone/ ..... http://foundationlife.net/2011/10/31/video-sharpton-attacks-pregnancy-centers/

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

"http://thegrio.com/2013/03/27/rev-al-sharpton-on-gay-marriage-debate-equality-includes-everyone/ ..... http://foundationlife.net/2011/10/31/video-sharpton-attacks-pregnancy-centers/"

Google searches I have done do not reveal that race baiter al devotes a lot of time standing up for gay rights or women's rights.

He has instigated violence against the Jewish people. I guess you consider that an example of how race baiter al never resorts to violence.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR

KENHYDERAL

Check this out

http://www.wsbtv.com/news/news/local/morehouse-athletes-accused-rape-case/nXdFJ/

How come these athletes did not get as much attention as the falsely accused Duke Lacrosse players.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR

KENHYDERAL

With reggard to the link I gave you in my previous comment, how come some national news magazine publish the pictures of the suspects. How come the local DA did not pronounce them hooligans? How come race baiter al and race baiter jesse not speak up for the victim.

KENNY, this victim was reportedly given a date rape drug.

kenhyderal said...

Dr. Harr: Invoke the "kenhyderal rule" or I'm out of here.

Anonymous said...

good riddance, troll.

kenhyderal said...

У вас есть двойной стандарт ?

Anonymous said...

Goodbye Kenny the troll.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

"Dr. Harr: Invoke the 'kenhyderal rule' or I'm out of here."

How many times have you threatened this.

Hoeve many times you have previously threatened this you have always returned.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

How many times has SIDNEY aactually invoked said "kenhyderal rule" in response to a KENHYDERAL ultimatum?

Zero.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

KENHYDERAL:

The Morehouse College rape happened in May of this year, almost 3 months ago. I googled first, "al sharpton on the Morehouse College rape" then "jesse jackson on the Morehouse College rape". How many actual references did I get?

ZERO!!!

It is said, dog bites an is not news. Man bites dog is. Was there no reaction from the black community or from Black Civil Rights leaders because black on black rape is not news?

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

The fact that race baiter al has not commented on the Morehouse College rape case does not show that he is actually very sympathetic to the right of women to be free from rape.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

Considering your non reaction to the Morehose College Rape Case, it seems you have double standards.

Anonymous said...

Kenny complains: У вас есть двойной стандарт ?

No, No double standard.

You are the only troll who pretends otherwise.

guiowen said...

Please don't pick on Kenny: he's just so happy about his ability to write Cyrillic script!

kenhyderal said...

It's Google translate cut and paste but of course, Guiowen, you know that. But, you can't resist the compulsion to respond with sarcasm. The point I was making is, none of the posters, so quick to call me a troll, had anything to say about a real troll; the nit-wit who posts his puerile chants and cuts and paste irrelevant passages of technical instructions in Russian onto the blog. Then again, from your way of thinking, anyone with an alternate point of view or anyone who agrees with Dr.Harr has to be labeled a racist and a troll. In an adjudicated debate, although you sometimes present strong arguments your inevitable resort to ad hominen attacks would make you a loser

kenhyderal said...

Anonymous said: "How many times has SIDNEY aactually invoked said "kenhyderal rule" in response to a KENHYDERAL ultimatum?
Zero"........ Wrong, he has deleted such posts and personally assured me he would continue do so. It's only recently this has started to occur once more. My continued participation, for what it's worth, is dependent on him living up to the personal commitment he gave me which prompted my return. I would like to see it broadened to eliminate plagiarism by the likes of Malik Williams and the violently offensive racist who goes on about Black Women

Anonymous said...

"adjudicated debate"? Hilarious........

Anonymous said...

Fianlly Brawley is having to pay at least some of the money she owes to at one of the men she FALSELY accused of rape. Too bad Sister Mangum isn't paying up.......after getting free legal services from four lawyers, and stalling for several years......it would be nice to see her repay just a tiny little bit of what she has cost taxpayers.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

"Wrong, he has deleted such posts and personally assured me he would continue do so. It's only recently this has started to occur once more."

Which says, in spite of delusions, that SIDNEY holds you in the same low regard which a lot of us do.

My continued participation, for what it's worth, is dependent on him living up to the personal commitment he gave me which prompted my return."

What it is worth is less than a fraction of a pre euro Italian lira, if even that much.

"I would like to see it broadened to eliminate plagiarism by the likes of Malik Williams and the violently offensive racist who goes on about Black Women".

Which makes me ask why you have not objected to the treatment of the student from Melon College by athletes from Morehead College?

Anonymous said...

Anonymous August 5, 2013 at 3:18 AM

Tawana has surprised me. I was sure, after the fund raiser, she would quit her job, take the money, and run and again go into hiding.

You notice race baiter al, whose debt to Stephen Pagones was paid off by others, including Johnnie Cochrane, was not noted for participating in the fund raiser.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

"I would like to see it broadened to eliminate plagiarism by the likes of Malik Williams and the violently offensive racist who goes on about Black Women".

At one point you were encouraging and praising Malek Williams.

I still believe Malek Williams was really KEN-Malek-HYDER-Williams_AL.

Anonymous said...

Regarding the Morehead College Rape Case:

While no trial has been held, it has been documented that the event involved multiple athletes having sex with a black woman who was incapacitatd because of drugs. It had a lot of features which SIDNEY and KENHYDERAL have alleged, without offering proof, took place at the Lacrosse party. Yet neither KENNY nor SIDNEY have commented on the Morehead case. Why?

In my opinion it is because they can not stir up black on white racism by criticizing black athletes who allegedly raped a black woman. It is also the reason why race baiter al and race baiter jesse have not commented.

Most violence against black people is perpetrated by other black people. SIDNEY, KENNY, al, jesse all try to portray it as a white on black phenomenon.

KENHYDERAL, please explain why that is not black on white racism.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

In reality, the "Kenhyderal rule" is, do not allow the publication of any facts which show KENHYDERAL is a blind, hypocritical, blatant unrepentant racist.

An example: under the "Kenhyderal rule", none of the facts of the phoney Duke rape case, most specifically the fact that no rape took place, would be published.

Anonymous said...

I think it's comical that Ken Edwards tries to claim black people are not racists and that "racism" does not exist in the black community. Here's why it is funny:
1. There is no such thing as the black community...just as there is no such monolith among whites, hispanics, etc. stupid superficial thinking to presume that blacks are some single-minded organism.
2. Psuedo-intellectuals (who can't get a job in the real world) have changed the definition of "racism" to include an element of "power to control broad systemic change". In other words, only whites have broad power to control systemic change, and therefore, racism only exists among whites. If you don't think a word fits your metanarrative, just change the definition of the word. If the facts don't fit your reality, change the facts.
3.Racism (racist thinking and racist actions) DO clearly exist in all ethic groups, cultures, nationalities, cliques, classes, genders, etc. It's idiotic for anybody to make a statement that blacks are not racist because racism does not exist in the black community. Pure academic dribble that is NOT supported by FACT

Anonymous said...

Hey, Walt........curious here.........where did Mangum get the $$ to post bond? Ever find out?

kenhyderal said...

@ Anonymous at 6:47; It's ironic that the same posters who decry Dr. Harr's qualifications and extoll those of Dr. Nichols can dismiss the opinion of highly qualified Social Scientists at virtually every major University, including Duke, about the nature of racism.

kenhyderal said...

Anonymous @ 5:51 said: " Yet neither KENNY nor SIDNEY have commented on the Morehead case. Why?
I'm not a crusader against injustice, although I do admire those who are, like Dr. Harr, Rev. Sharpton and Rev Jackson. I'm only here to advocate for my friend Crystal and to correct the lies that were disseminated about her by the greedy Trial Lawyers in support of their ill-fated lawsuits, launched on behalf of the Duke Lacrosse defendants.

kenhyderal said...

Anonymous @ 3:00 AM said: ""adjudicated debate"? Hilarious:........ You think?

guiowen said...

Kenhyderal,
Suppose you give us your definition of racism.
Or do you feel that by asking you this, I'm engaging in an ad hominem argument?

Anonymous said...

Uh, highly qualified social scientists? Like at duke? You mean, like, Wahneeeeeeema Lubiano, the perpetual non-publisher of her infamous "forthcoming" book? Or, perhaps, that famous former Duke professor, Houston Baker, who told the mother of one of the LAX players she had given birth to a farm animal? Or perhaps Tim Tyson, who didn't mind having his picture posted on the Internet dressed in bondage/sado-masochistic costumes? Those qualified social scientists, Kenny Hissy? My, My.....you ARE a mental giant, aren't you....

Anonymous said...

Or perhaps Ken Edwards means those fine upstanding social scientists at Duke who were all gushy-supportive of those who posted signs that read "Castrate them"......
Yep, highly qualified......academic slagheap....

Anonymous said...

oh guiowen, there you go with your hominy again......Kenny Hissy thinks you are full of beans, anyway. :)

Anonymous said...

....Lubiano, that well qualified social scientist at Duke.....here's a comment from a national recognized academic who attended a conference where Lubiano was keynote....
"The Manhattan Institute’s Heather MacDonald, who attended a conference at which Lubiano spoke, recalled the atmosphere:

The final impression left by the conference had less to do with the substance of the debate about the “academic culture wars,” numbingly familiar as it is, than with its style. After hours of being bombarded with impenetrable syntax and utterly predictable slogans, one stumbled out of the conference hall profoundly depressed by the state of academic speech.".....

In other words, Lubiano and her ilk at Duke spend their class time stringing together nonsensical horseshit sentences, in the form of "big" words.....Kathy Holloway, another mental giant at duke, can't spell, much less write.....MUCH less contribute to the intellectual body of work on racism or any other "ism".
gee, no-conscious cline would fit right in.....

Anonymous said...

Whatever happened to:
1. The famous visit to the specialty hospital outpatient ER that Mangum was supposed to have had weeks before the big blowup with Daye?
2. the famous photos that were supposed to show us mangum all beaten up after her hour of sheer terror?
3. the proof that daye was a hardcore alcoholic woman-beating wild man?
4. Mangum's release when the prosecution was supposed to drop the case? Or, the famous plea deal?
hmmmmmmm.......

Anonymous said...

well, the trial is pushed back to November. How much longer do you think she can stall, Walt?

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

"@ Anonymous at 6:47; It's ironic that the same posters who decry Dr. Harr's qualifications and extoll those of Dr. Nichols"

What credentials on the part of SIDNEY HARR?

"can dismiss the opinion of highly qualified Social Scientists at virtually every major University, including Duke, about the nature of racism."

Social Scientists who deny obvious reality are highly qualified at nothing. They choose to be oblivious, just like you.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

"Yet neither KENNY nor SIDNEY have commented on the Morehead case. Why?
I'm not a crusader against injustice,"

That's for sure. You are a crusader FOR injustice.

"although I do admire those who are, like Dr. Harr, Rev. Sharpton and Rev Jackson."

There are no crusaders against injustice in that group. Like you, they are crusaders FOR injustice, which s the real reason you admire them.

"I'm only here to advocate for my friend Crystal and to correct the lies that were disseminated about her by the greedy Trial Lawyers in support of their ill-fated lawsuits, launched on behalf of the Duke Lacrosse defendants."

The only lie disseminated about Crystal was that she was the victim of a gang rape. You are crusading to promulgate that lie. Ergo, res ipsa loquitur, yoy crusade FOR injustice.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

"@ Anonymous at 6:47; It's ironic that the same posters who decry Dr. Harr's qualifications and extoll those of Dr. Nichols can dismiss the opinion of highly qualified Social Scientists at virtually every major University, including Duke, about the nature of racism."

Said "highly sualified social scientists", as another poster has pointed out are people like Wahneema Lubiano and Madonna Constantine. Such people are not highly qualified at anything except denying the reality of Black on White Racism.

I ask again, if White on Black racism is such a problem how come such "highly qualified social scientists" can point only to such examples as Tawana Brawley and Crystal Mangum, false accusers of racially motivated crimes.

So far as George Zimmerman is concened, there is more evidence that he is innocent than ther was that OJ was.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

"Anonymous @ 5:51 said: " Yet neither KENNY nor SIDNEY have commented on the Morehead case. Why?
I'm not a crusader against injustice,"

BULLSHIT!!!

You do not comment because if you compared that case with the phoney Duke Lacrosse case, you would have to confront the reality of black on white racism, to which you would rather remain oblivious.

Anonymous said...

Well, let's see......if Kenny CryBaby's definition of racism is accurate (the academic bullshit version) , then I suppose we need to apply the same definition worldwide. How about Africa, Kenny whiner, where there is a clear majority of black people.....who routinely discriminate against THEIR OWN RACE./ Or the numerous other dark skinned nations where people of color DO routinely and horribly discriminate against others?

Nifong Supporter said...


Anonymous said...
sidney = dumb lawyer wannabe. Sidney = failed lawyer wannabe. Sidney = failed physician. Sidney = liar.....


Your word math does not add up.

Nifong Supporter said...


Walt said...
Sid wrote: "Whether or not North Carolina has a Stand Your Ground law or not, Shan Carter cannot outrun a bullet. Fleeing was not an option for Carter if he wanted to survive and he had every reason to believe that his life was in imminent danger. He acted legally when all facts are considered."

The problem is Sid, Demitrius Greene was killed by Carter while Carter was pursuing Tyrone Baker. As I discussed above under North Carolina's transferred intent rule, that was Murder in the First Degree.

You can try all you want to dehumanize Demetrius. You can ignore all the law in the world to justify his murder. You can stick up for a drug dealing thug all you want. But the facts are the facts. Carter murdered Demetrius Greene.

Walt-in-Durham


Walt, you are not paying attention. As I said, Carter ran in the same direction as Baker in order to prevent Baker from using the corner of a building for cover. He fired his weapon in Baker's direction to keep Baker's attention on fleeing and provide him with time to get into his car and drive away.

Also, I do not see how you conclude that I dehumanize Demetrius Green. I do not justify Green's death (which was an accident) but Carter was definitely justified in shooting at Baker.

Finally, I don't stick up for thugs, I stick up for justice.

Nifong Supporter said...


Anonymous said...
SIDNEY HARR:

Check this out:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Felon_in_possession_of_a_firearm

"Being a felon in possession of a firearm is a felony in most U.S. states and in the federal system, per 18 U.S.C. § 922(g)"

Check this out:

http://www.ncga.state.nc.us/EnactedLegislation/Statutes/pdf/ByArticle/Chapter_14/Article_54A.pdf

A felon in North Carolina commits a felony by possessing a firearm(unless his right to possess a firearm is restored by the justice system).

Shan Carter was committing a felony by possessing a firearm. Regardless of the circumstances, if he fired his gun and killed someone, he would have killed that person while committing a felony.

In just about all jurisdictions, the felony murder rule would apply.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Felony_murder_rule

"...when an offender kills accidentally or without specific intent to kill in the commission of a felony, the offender can be charged with murder."


That is what is wrong with the "felony-murder rule." Carter, in shooting Baker, under the circumstances, was acting in self defense (which is not a crime), and it had nothing to do with his drug-dealing activity.

Nifong Supporter said...


Anonymous said...
Fianlly Brawley is having to pay at least some of the money she owes to at one of the men she FALSELY accused of rape. Too bad Sister Mangum isn't paying up.......after getting free legal services from four lawyers, and stalling for several years......it would be nice to see her repay just a tiny little bit of what she has cost taxpayers.


Mangum is not costing taxpayers money... the Durham prosecutors, in kowtowing to the Powers-That-Be, in carrying out the vendetta prosecution of Mangum, are responsible for squandering taxpayer dollars. The charges against Mangum should never have been brought, and mark my words... she will never be convicted of them. Charges will be dropped!!

Nifong Supporter said...


Anonymous said...
Whatever happened to:
1. The famous visit to the specialty hospital outpatient ER that Mangum was supposed to have had weeks before the big blowup with Daye?
2. the famous photos that were supposed to show us mangum all beaten up after her hour of sheer terror?
3. the proof that daye was a hardcore alcoholic woman-beating wild man?
4. Mangum's release when the prosecution was supposed to drop the case? Or, the famous plea deal?
hmmmmmmm.......


My Anonymous friend, be patient. All will be revealed soon.

Nifong Supporter said...


Anonymous said...
well, the trial is pushed back to November. How much longer do you think she can stall, Walt?


You got it all wrong. It is the prosecution that is stalling because it has no case and is trying to hope that Mangum does something to give them an excuse to take away her bail and then force her to accept a plea deal in order to be released.

Mangum is in limbo while she awaits trial. Stalling is not to her advantage.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

"Anonymous said...
sidney = dumb lawyer wannabe. Sidney = failed lawyer wannabe. Sidney = failed physician. Sidney = liar.....


Your word math does not add up."

You are right. It does not add up to what a gross liar you are.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

"Walt, you are not paying attention. As I said, Carter ran in the same direction as Baker in order to prevent Baker from using the corner of a building for cover. He fired his weapon in Baker's direction to keep Baker's attention on fleeing and provide him with time to get into his car and drive away."

SIDNEY, you are showing your ignorance. Self defense law says clearly, once the assailant withdraws, the assailed must cease the use of deadly force. Firing a gun is deadly force. No matter how you try to spin it, Shan Carter pursued Tyrone Baker after Tyrone Baker and kept shooting at him.

"Also, I do not see how you conclude that I dehumanize Demetrius Green. I do not justify Green's death (which was an accident) but Carter was definitely justified in shooting at Baker."

What do you call your argument, that Shan Carter should not be held criminally responsible for Demetrius Green's death because he did not intend to shoot him and was unaware he had killed him. That IS how you argued self defense for Shan Carter initially.

"Finally, I don't stick up for thugs, I stick up for justice."

So why are you trying to defend convicted criminal Shan Harrison from criminal responsibility for killing Tyrone Baker and Demetrius Green? Do you really expect people to believe you do not stand up for thugs.

What really makes this laughable is that you tried to stand up for Demario Atwater, convicted criminal, after he deliberately, wantonly killed Eve Carson.

People, do you believe SIDNEY does not stand up for thugs?

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

"That is what is wrong with the 'felony-murder rule.' Carter, in shooting Baker, under the circumstances, was acting in self defense (which is not a crime), and it had nothing to do with his drug-dealing activity."

I say again, he was in illegal possession of a firearm while selling illegal drugs on the street. Further, the confrontation was triggered by another felony, Shan Carter's breaking into Tyrone Baker's apartment and stealing tens of thousands of dollars.

You argue self defense for a convicted criminal on non existent grounds for self defense and you want people to believe you do not stick up for thugs.

HAH!!!

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

"Mangum is not costing taxpayers money... the Durham prosecutors, in kowtowing to the Powers-That-Be, in carrying out the vendetta prosecution of Mangum, are responsible for squandering taxpayer dollars. The charges against Mangum should never have been brought, and mark my words... she will never be convicted of them. Charges will be dropped!!"

This from SIDNEY who thinks that a convicted felon who opens fire on people while he is committing felonies should get a pass on felony murder on the grounds of self defense.

SIDNEY, your absolute stupidity and conceit speak for themselves.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

"My Anonymous friend, be patient. All will be revealed soon."

SIDNEY you have been promising that for years and keep promising that even though you can reveal nothing.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

"You got it all wrong. It is the prosecution that is stalling because it has no case and is trying to hope that Mangum does something to give them an excuse to take away her bail and then force her to accept a plea deal in order to be released.

Mangum is in limbo while she awaits trial. Stalling is not to her advantage."

Again, this comes from someone who thinks a convicte thug should get a pass for killing two people while ommitting felonies.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

Why don't you comment on why the Morehouse College rape case has not drawn the same attention from the media and the black activists as the phoney Duke rape case.

In the Morehouse College case, there is probable cause to believe a black woman was gang raped by athletes. No such probable cause existed in the Duke phoney rape case.

Do you duck the Morehouse College case because the accused athletes are all black?

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

"That is what is wrong with the 'felony-murder rule.' Carter, in shooting Baker, under the circumstances, was acting in self defense (which is not a crime), and it had nothing to do with his drug-dealing activity."

Great. SIDNEY proposes that the felony murder rule be done away with so a convicted criminal, while in the midst of committing felonies and killing two people, one an innocent young boy, can plead self defense and get a pass.

You are some fighter for justice, SIDNEY---NOT!!!!

kenhyderal said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
kenhyderal said...

Guiowen said: "Suppose you give us your definition of racism.
Or do you feel that by asking you this, I'm engaging in an ad hominem argument".... I have no quarrel with the dictionary definition of racism. This is not an argument about semantics, it's a question of whether the phenomena known as reverse racism has any validity and whether it's a major problem for white people in America. Collins...racism or racialism n 1. the belief that races have distinctive cultural characteristics determined by hereditary factors and that this endows some races with an intrinsic superiority over others
2. abusive or aggressive behaviour towards members of another race on the basis of such a belief....eg Cultural Dictionary The belief that some races are inherently superior physically,intellectually, or culturally) to others and therefore have a right to dominate them. In the United States, racism, particularly by whites against blacks, has created profound racial tension and conflict in virtually all aspects of American society. Until the breakthroughs achieved by the civil rights movement in the 1950s and 1960s, white domination over blacks was institutionalized and supported in all branches and levels of government, by denying blacks their civil rights and opportunities to participate in political, economic, and social communities.The American Heritage® New Dictionary of Cultural Literacy. This essay illustrates my views well. http://soindetail.tumblr.com/post/51316240491/why-reverse-racism-doesnt-exist Americans harbor deep embarrassment about their shameful racist past. "To assuage this shame, they rationalize by saying "Oh, Blacks are just as racist as anyone else. Wrong. "Canadians are just as racist as Americans because of how they treated their Native People". Wrong.
Dr. Daniel Patrick Moynihan in his 1965 report wrote, "American slavery was the worst version of slavery in human history" Only the Boors of south Africa come even close. Too many vestiges of this still remain; a disgraceful situation in a supposedly civilized country

Anonymous said...

Do you ever wonder if the blacks who were in charge of their people while in slavery (as every society - even slave societies - have their own form of social structure and control - be it parental or most senior or most powerful or richest - etc.).

perhaps it is a part of the culture itself that feeds upon itself instead of leading and supporting a society that flourishes and is as much of the native culture as the native culture is of them.

the peaceful protest thing is good for forcing governments to change their biased ways - but at the heart of the people - we just don't want to blamed for what others may have done to them - as we are many generations and many times continents away from that american history - and seeing and being alive in the present with that much racial tension fanned for no other reason than politics, money, votes, and other nefarious reasons too many to count - the only real progress made it seems is more racial profiling and negativity is produced instead of enlightenment and civil advancement in the courts and justice system - more racial divide and suspicion and intolerance is created - as in the ways that have currently been pushed upon the usa populace for ... way too many years now

it is easier to notice around places like durham and such - where there are large populations of blacks that may or may not of origins in the history of slavery in america engrained in their societial environment. in durham and nc it is very noticeable because of the slave history of this state - and duke in particular when it is durham and surrounding areas and politics and health care and media and government and the court system and the judial system and in the people's eyes that you meet on the street ...

it is very noticeable ... and it goes both ways at this point in time ... which is understandable ... but real nontheless

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

Definitions of Racism:

"1. the belief that races have distinctive cultural characteristics determined by hereditary factors and that this endows some races with an intrinsic superiority over others"

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/politics/special/clinton/frenzy/jackson.htm. Jesse Jackson calls Jews "Hymies" and refers to New York as Hymietown. Hymie is a term equivalent to "Nigger".

http://www.discoverthenetworks.org/articles/outragedagainsharptonrecord.html

race baiter al: “White folks was in the caves while we [blacks] was building empires … We built pyramids before Donald Trump ever knew what architecture was … we taught philosophy and astrology and mathematics before Socrates and them Greek homos ever got around to it.”

2. abusive or aggressive behaviour towards members of another race on the basis of such a belief".

Caucasian Duke Athletes are falsely accused of raping Crystal. Black activists use the incident to stir up black animosity towards white people. That includes race baiter al.

Tawana Brawley falsely accuses white men of raping her. Although they are aware that it is a hoax, black activists, including race baiter al, use the incident to stir up black animosity towards white people.

Crown Heights: a car driven by a Jewish driver accidentally strikes and kills a black child. Race baiter al uses the incident to stir up black animosity against Jewish people in Crown Heights. The result is black people rioting and killing a number of Jewish people.

Two black criminals deliberately and wantonly murder Eve Carson. Black people claim it happened because Eve Carson had flaunted her wealth.

Four black criminals wantonly, brutally kill Channon Christian and Chris Newsome.

In the wake of the George Zimmerman verdict, there are numerous incidents of black people assaulting white people in revenge. White people did not assault black people following the OJ Simpson verdict.

Accoding to KENHYDERAL, black on white racism does not exist because "experts" like Wahneema Lubiano say it does not.

Anonymous said...

Said it before and I will gladly say it again......if Carter ever finally gets strapped to a gurney, I would volunteer to push the plunger. Oh, and if the scum who murdered Eve Carson (and others, apparently) were, by some chance, to find themselves facing the death penalty.........I would perform the same task for them, too, without one ounce of concern. Unforunately, the Carson murderers will take up oxygen for years to come....at taxpayer expense.
God bless Texas.....the great state just executed Doug Feldman......another piece of trash.....who shot down two truck drivers just because they pissed him off. Oh, by the way, in case sidney or troll-boy wants to whine about executions in Texas as being racially biased......in the past 24 years, there were more whites convicted, sentenced, sent to death row and executed.....than blacks and hispanics.....significantly more, in fact. And Feldman was white......and very well educated....and well off financially.....and STILL got it. God bless Texas.

Walt said...

Sid wrote: "Walt, you are not paying attention. As I said, Carter ran in the same direction as Baker in order to prevent Baker from using the corner of a building for cover."

Paying attention is more than just accepting your word. Paying attention means reading the case facts. Self-defense now and in 1997 under North Carolina law ends when pursuit begins. St. v. Carter, 357 N.C. 345; 584 S.E.2d 792 (2003). Thus, Carter's last three shots were not fired in self-defense. In fact, those were fired intentionally. Couple that with Carter's admission through you that previously he had not been armed and you get the element of premeditation necessary to prove Murder in the First Degree.

"He fired his weapon in Baker's direction to keep Baker's attention on fleeing and provide him with time to get into his car and drive away."

That's his story now, but not when he was on trial. Carter's trial testimony about the first two shots was conflicting. At one point, he said: "I didn't want to shoot first, I wanted to go ahead . . . and do what I had to do before [Baker] did it to me. So I went ahead and pulled my gun out and I shot at him." That tends to prove he, somewhat reluctantly, decided to kill Baker. Later in his testimony he said that the first two shots were aimed at the ground and only intended to buy him time and space to escape to his car. The jury elected to believe his first statement. Since they were at the trial and had the opportunity to see and hear Carter and all the evidence, I'll go with their decision.

However, there is no doubt about what happened next. After being struck but not immediately killed by one of Carter's bullets, Baker fled. At that point, Carter had two choices. First act consistently with one part of his trial testimony and flee to his car or give pursuit. He pursued shooting three more times. Again, quoting Carter himself: "[Baker] ran and I went behind him shooting at him." It was during this pursuit phase that Carter killed young Demitrius Greene. Under the transferred intent rule Greene's killing was Murder in the First Degree.

"Also, I do not see how you conclude that I dehumanize Demetrius Green. I do not justify Green's death (which was an accident) but Carter was definitely justified in shooting at Baker."

In two ways. Until now, you have refused to even admit Demetrius even had a name. Second, you still claim this was an accident. Killing someone while shooting at someone you are pursuing is not an accident. It's Murder.

Walt-in-Durham
Finally, I don't stick up for thugs, I stick up for justice.

Walt said...

Sid wrote: "Finally, I don't stick up for thugs, I stick up for justice."

No, you don't. You stick up for murderous thugs who murder innocent young boys.

Walt-in-Durham

Anonymous said...

Which community invented and uses the "niggardly" racist word "spike"? Huh, sidney? A spike is a "Kike" (jew) who is Hispanic. (spic). And yeah, sidney, it's common street trash talk among blacks in Florida. And what was the race of the four Florida cretins who beat up a Jewish man (in his 70s) two weeks ago because he refused to allow them to play their "rap" filth at loud volumes in his store? They beat him badly and, yeah, told him he was a "Zimmer pig".
No racism? Nah, of course not.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

Whether or not you like the evidence, the overwhelming majority of violence against black people is perpetrated by black people. Yet people like race baiter al and race baiter jesse and, sadly, President Obama portray it as a white on black phenomenin.

That speaks very loudly for itself that it is black on white racism, in spite of the bias of so called academic experts.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

"Finally, I don't stick up for thugs, I stick up for justice."

You do stick up for a criminal who falsely accused three innocent members of the Duke Lacrosse Team of raping her. How is that justice?

Speaking of the Duke Lacrosse hoax, you made an issue of the alleged background of the Duke Lacrosse team. You never mention the background of convicted felon Shan Carter in your attempt to "sanctify" his murder of two men under the guise of self defense.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

Black leaders were justifiably outraged over the brutal murder of James Byrd. They were not outraged over the brutal murders of Eve Carson, of Channon Christian and Chris Newsome by black criminals.

Why?

Was it because they did not to acknowledge that black criminals would wantonly, brutally murder white people?

If so, that was and is black on white racism, regardless of how many academic experts you can cite.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

Something more you would like to have banned under the so called "Kenhyderal rule":

Tawana Brawley falsely accused white men of raping her. Crystal Mangum falsely accused white men of raping her. Black leaders used these incidents to stir up black animosity towards white people.

At Morehouse College, athletes are arrested and charged with rape. There was a party. Multiple black athletes had sex with a black woman. The woman was impaired from a drug ingestion. Sound familiar?

Black leaders ignore the incident at Morehouse College. To apply a principle which was applied to the innocent Duke Lacrosse players, even if they did not commit rape, what they did commit was bad enough-unless you do not think that multiple black athletes taking advantage of an impaired black woman to have sex with her was bad.

Black leaders like race baiter al and race baiter jesse make no mention of the Morehouse incident. President Obama, after the incident, goes to Morehouse to give the Commencement address.

Crime on Black people is committed in the overwhelming majority of instances by other black people. Do black leaders ever mention that? Rarely if ever. Do Black leaders try to portray crime against black people as a white on black phenomenon. All the time.

That is evidence of black on white racism, which is not refuted by your repeated denials.

Anonymous said...

Walt in Durham quoting Shan Carter' trial testimony:

"I didn't want to shoot first, I wanted to go ahead . . . and do what I had to do before [Baker] did it to me. So I went ahead and pulled my gun out and I shot at him."

SIDNEY HARR:

Shan Carter admitted under oath he was carrying a gun. As a convicted felon, under North Carolina it was a felony for him to carry a gun. Shan Carter admitted he had been committing a felony when he shot at Tyrone Baker.

So justify that he acted in self defense when, while committing a felony, he pursued Tyrone Baker and continued to fire on him.

Squirm, SIDNEY, squirm.

guiowen said...

Kenhyderal said...

" I have no quarrel with the dictionary definition of racism. This is not an argument about semantics, it's a question of whether the phenomena [sic] known as reverse racism has any validity and whether it's a major problem for white people in America."

Yesterday, you said that, according to the experts, such a thing as black on-white racism doesn't exist. Today you seem to acknowledge it does exist, but claim it's just not a major problem. Maybe we are making some (slight) progress with you?

Anonymous said...

Oh, I get it........Trollboy is saying that racism, as long as it isn't a big problem, isn't racism. right! so, when a black creep beats up an asian store owner in Baltimore and calls the store owner a "slope", it's only a little bitty racist act.....
Or, when black Lovette kidnaps, shoots, murders, and throws white Eve Carson in a ditch......and later says, "the white bitch be a ho, anyway"....why, my goodness, it's just another teeny little racist killing. No big deal, right, troll?

Anonymous said...

...Stuart Taylor, Jr.....quote from The Potomac, article about the LAX rape hoax....
"(Mr. Taylor) opined that the Duke case has a large rogues gallery that does not (NOT) include the Duke Three, but "does include more than 90 members of the Duke faculty who have prejudged the case, with some exuding the anti-white racism and disdain for student-athletes that pollutes many college faculties" as well as "former Princeton University President William Bowen and civil-rights lawyer Julius Chambers [who] went out of their way to slime the lacrosse players in a report on the Duke administration's handling of the rape scandal — a report that is a parody of race-obsessed political correctness."
No reverse racism? Bullshit!!

Anonymous said...

Another example of racism by that scumbag, Farrakhan........condemned by a member of Congress....

"U.S. Rep. John Conyers, a Detroit Democrat, apologized today for Louis Farrakhan’s anti-Semitic comments during a talk he gave in a Detroit church last week.

Conyers, who attended Farrakhan’s speech Friday night at Fellowship Chapel, issued a strong statement that distanced himself from the Nation of Islam leader’s remarks, which were blasted earlier this week by a Jewish civil rights group and others.

“Farrakhan made unacceptable racist, anti-Semitic and homophobic statements, which I condemn in the strongest possible terms,” Conyers said. “It was my expectation that Minister Farrakhan’s speech would focus on the many challenges facing the city of Detroit. In previous days, he had discussed efforts to revitalize our city by purchasing property and investing in blighted neighborhoods. Regrettably, he used this opportunity to promote views that have no place in civilized discourse.”

As the Free Press reported exclusively, Farrakhan attacked what he called “Satanic Jews” and the “Synagogue of Satan,” claiming Jewish people control major institutions in the U.S., such as the news media. Farrakhan also alleged that President Barack Obama “surrounded himself with Satan ... members of the Jewish community.”

In the same speech this BLACK man also made obscene remarks about gays.
Your hero, sidney and troll boy? another fine upstanding member of the black (no racism) community?

Anonymous said...

Anybody who says there is no reverse racism in the black community is (a)a liar, (b)an idiot, and (c)a racist

Anonymous said...

I thought harr was just a mere aging crackpot who thought himself witty and who enjoyed drawing attention to himself....as an attempt to cover up his own insecurities. Now, with this latest dose of crap, supporting the child-murdering Carter, I am truly convinced the man is deeply racist, hate-filled, an embarrassment to the profession of medicine, and suffering from both progressive dementia and plain old ignorance.

Anonymous said...

well, McClain died 13 days after the incident involving the BLACK guard, Council. And now Council has been indicted. Let's see, sidney, a death 13 days later...gonna say Council ought to get a pass because (a)he is black, and/or because (b)Mcclain's death was due to hospital murder, or (c)Council was defending himself???? Hmmmmm, what's gonna be the excuse to cover up black on black apparent crime this time? Or, perhaps, you will say it was really an evil white oppressor who actually killed Mcclain and then...blamed Council....the VERY black man who you tried to pass off, by ommission, as white. Just gets better and better, doesn't it, sidney

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

If one provokes another to attack him, if he kills the attacker, even if he feared for his life, he could not plead self defense.

The confrontation was provoked by Shan Carter's commission of a felony against Tyrone Baker, breaking into Tyrone's apartment and stealing tens of thousands of dollars.

And your self defense claim implies you believe Shan Carter did not provoke the confrontation by perpetrating a felony.

Do you really believe this bullshit?

Anonymous said...

Anonymous August 6, 2013 at 12:55 PM

SIDNEY will still claim he was not playing the race card when he pictured guard Council as white.

SIDNEY, like just about all Black racists, pictures violence against black people as white upon black. He can not incite black anger against white people by depicting violence against black for what it really is-black on black violence.

kenhyderal said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
kenhyderal said...

Guiowen @7:11 said: "Yesterday, you said that, according to the experts, such a thing as black on-white racism doesn't exist. Today you seem to acknowledge it does exist, but claim it's just not a major problem. Maybe we are making some (slight) progress with you?......... No, I concede to the experts. The trend, lately, by those who, vainly, hope to mitigate their shame over the continuing racism against African Americans, is to claim the problem has now become black on white racism, the so-called reverse racism. This construct of theirs is illusory

kenhyderal said...

Anonymous @ 5:02 said: God bless Texas"..... In civilized places the death penalty has been abolished.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

"No, I concede to the experts. The trend, lately, by those who, vainly, hope to mitigate their shame over the continuing racism against African Americans, is to claim the problem has now become black on white racism, the so-called reverse racism. This construct of theirs is illusory".

No it isn't.You are blind.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:


"No, I concede to the experts. The trend, lately, by those who, vainly, hope to mitigate their shame over the continuing racism against African Americans, is to claim the problem has now become black on white racism, the so-called reverse racism. This construct of theirs is illusory"

How did the Tawana Brawley hoax show "continuing racism against African Americans"?

Anonymous said...

God Bless uncivilized Texas.......
As Ron White said, "some states have outlawed the death penalty. Here in Texas, we have an express lane". And by God, scum like Lovette and Carter would be welcomed to death row.

Anonymous said...

certainly - blacks have mastered the ability to not act in racist and discriminatory manners ... but whites haven't (sic)

do you truly think that is an accurate or valid statement or way of thinking about whole races of people other than in a racist manner in the first place?

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

Check this out:

http://www.delcotimes.com/articles/2013/08/06/sports/doc52014b8eb425c614361333.txt

And you say black people are not racist. This is a story about a black man hurling racial slurs at another black man.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

Another HARRISM:

When a convicted felon provokes a confrontation, in which he is already committing a felony by carrying an illegal concealed firearm, if he kills the attacker it is self defense, and when he kills an innocent bystander, a child, in the course of killing the attacker, it was not murder because he did not intend to kill the child and had not realized he had done it, especially if he is black.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

Statistics confirm that when a black man is killed, in the overwhelming majority of cases, the shooter is another black man. When a black woman is raped, in the overwhelming majority of cases the perpetrator is a black man.

Are you going to claim that all of this is a consequence of white racism?

Why do black leaders like race baiter al and race baiter jesse and race baiter farrakhan make issues of hoaxes(Tawana, Crystal) but not of black on black crime?

I say again, they can not stir up black animosity towards white people that way.

Nifong Supporter said...


Anonymous said...
SIDNEY HARR:

"Walt, you are not paying attention. As I said, Carter ran in the same direction as Baker in order to prevent Baker from using the corner of a building for cover. He fired his weapon in Baker's direction to keep Baker's attention on fleeing and provide him with time to get into his car and drive away."

SIDNEY, you are showing your ignorance. Self defense law says clearly, once the assailant withdraws, the assailed must cease the use of deadly force. Firing a gun is deadly force. No matter how you try to spin it, Shan Carter pursued Tyrone Baker after Tyrone Baker and kept shooting at him.

"Also, I do not see how you conclude that I dehumanize Demetrius Green. I do not justify Green's death (which was an accident) but Carter was definitely justified in shooting at Baker."

What do you call your argument, that Shan Carter should not be held criminally responsible for Demetrius Green's death because he did not intend to shoot him and was unaware he had killed him. That IS how you argued self defense for Shan Carter initially.

"Finally, I don't stick up for thugs, I stick up for justice."

So why are you trying to defend convicted criminal Shan Harrison from criminal responsibility for killing Tyrone Baker and Demetrius Green? Do you really expect people to believe you do not stand up for thugs.

What really makes this laughable is that you tried to stand up for Demario Atwater, convicted criminal, after he deliberately, wantonly killed Eve Carson.

People, do you believe SIDNEY does not stand up for thugs?


First, even thugs deserve to be treated with justice... and I do not concede that Shan Carter is a thug with that statement.

Secondly, I have never stood up for DeMario Atwater or the other murderer of Eve Carson.

Nifong Supporter said...


Anonymous said...
SIDNEY HARR:

"That is what is wrong with the 'felony-murder rule.' Carter, in shooting Baker, under the circumstances, was acting in self defense (which is not a crime), and it had nothing to do with his drug-dealing activity."

I say again, he was in illegal possession of a firearm while selling illegal drugs on the street. Further, the confrontation was triggered by another felony, Shan Carter's breaking into Tyrone Baker's apartment and stealing tens of thousands of dollars.

You argue self defense for a convicted criminal on non existent grounds for self defense and you want people to believe you do not stick up for thugs.

HAH!!!


I repeat, even thugs, criminals, hooligans, and felons have the legal right to defend themselves... and that was all that Shan did when he shot Baker.

End of story.

Nifong Supporter said...


Anonymous said...
SIDNEY HARR:

Why don't you comment on why the Morehouse College rape case has not drawn the same attention from the media and the black activists as the phoney Duke rape case.

In the Morehouse College case, there is probable cause to believe a black woman was gang raped by athletes. No such probable cause existed in the Duke phoney rape case.

Do you duck the Morehouse College case because the accused athletes are all black?
Anonymous said...
SIDNEY HARR:

Why don't you comment on why the Morehouse College rape case has not drawn the same attention from the media and the black activists as the phoney Duke rape case.

In the Morehouse College case, there is probable cause to believe a black woman was gang raped by athletes. No such probable cause existed in the Duke phoney rape case.

Do you duck the Morehouse College case because the accused athletes are all black?


I don't comment on the Morehouse College rape case because I do not know much about it... and the reason the media does not cover it is probably because it doesn't care about the victim or perpetrators because they are all black.

Furthermore, I have not really waded into the Duke Lacrosse rape case itself. My position is that its prosecutor Mike Nifong was unjustly treated. With Mangum, I concentrate on the issues regarding the charges currently against her, not the past Duke Lacrosse case.

Comprende, mi amigo, or is more elucidation required?

Nifong Supporter said...


Anonymous said...
SIDNEY HARR:

"Finally, I don't stick up for thugs, I stick up for justice."

You do stick up for a criminal who falsely accused three innocent members of the Duke Lacrosse Team of raping her. How is that justice?

Speaking of the Duke Lacrosse hoax, you made an issue of the alleged background of the Duke Lacrosse team. You never mention the background of convicted felon Shan Carter in your attempt to "sanctify" his murder of two men under the guise of self defense.


Whoa... Inhale deeply. I just uploaded the introductory part of Shan Carter's case. Fact is that subsequent chapters deal specifically with details of Shan's upbringing. Some are already finished and ready to be uploaded. I'll do it when I get a chance. (I've been very busy recently.)

Lance the Supreme Poster of Enlightenment said...

"First, even thugs deserve to be treated with justice... and I do not concede that Shan Carter is a thug with that statement."

Shan Carter is an admitted drug pusher, thief, and with the death of Demetrius Greene, killer.

He also has a prior conviction for murder, robbery, and kidnapping.

What, in your mind Sid, determines whether a person is a thug?

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

"First, even thugs deserve to be treated with justice..."

That is correct.

"and I do not concede that Shan Carter is a thug with that statement."

If you believe he is not a thug, you, like your acolyte KENHYDERAL, are blind.

"Secondly, I have never stood up for DeMario Atwater or the other murderer of Eve Carson."

Yes you have. Years ago on your blog you said the publication of pictures of people of interest showing Atwater and Lovette jeopardized their right to a fair trial.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

"I repeat, even thugs, criminals, hooligans, and felons have the legal right to defend themselves... and that was all that Shan did when he shot Baker.

End of story."

Parts of the story you left out:

Shan Carter provoked the attack.

Shan Carter was in illegal possession of a deadly weapon

Shan Carter pursued Tyrone Baker and fired at him while Tyrone Baker was fleeing.

That was not self defense. That was Shan Carter perpetrating a deadly assault on Tyrone Baker with an illegal deadly weapon. That is felony murder.

The thing you most glaringly omit is that while Shan Carter was committing a deadly assault on Tyrone Baker with an illegal firearm, he killed an innocent bystander. How can you say that is not felony murder?

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

"I don't comment on the Morehouse College rape case because I do not know much about it..."

No, you do not comment on the Morehouse College rape case because it is an example of black on black violence and you can not use it to stir up Black hatred of white people.

"and the reason the media does not cover it is probably because it doesn't care about the victim or perpetrators because they are all black."

No, the media has not commented on it because it is not something which can be distorted into white on black violence the way they distorted the phony Duke rape case.

"Furthermore, I have not really waded into the Duke Lacrosse rape case itself. My position is that its prosecutor Mike Nifong was unjustly treated. With Mangum, I concentrate on the issues regarding the charges currently against her, not the past Duke Lacrosse case."

BULLSHIT!!!

Comprende, mi amigo, or is more elucidation required?

I comprehend. You obviously do not.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

"Whoa... Inhale deeply. I just uploaded the introductory part of Shan Carter's case. Fact is that subsequent chapters deal specifically with details of Shan's upbringing. Some are already finished and ready to be uploaded. I'll do it when I get a chance. (I've been very busy recently.)"

I doubt that, considering your purposefully oblivious description of what Shan Carter did.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

"the reason the media does not cover [the Morehead College rape case] is probably because it doesn't care about the victim or perpetrators because they are all black."

The media did not very extensively cover the brutal rape and murder of Channon Christian.

The media did not cover the rape of a white woman by black man Michael Jermaine Burch.

It seems the only type of rape case covered extensively in the media is the phony rape case in which a black woman falsely alleges she was raped why white men, e.g. Tawana Brawley, Crystal Mangum.

And you can't see anything odd in that situation.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

"First, even thugs deserve to be treated with justice".

But white men falsely accused of raping a black woman should not. That is what you have blogged.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

First, even thugs deserve to be treated with justice".

For a thug who kills two people while in commission of felonies, justice would be conviction of two counts of Murder 1 and the appropriate sentence. Allowing said thug to get a pass for pleading self defense would be mercy, not justice.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

One thing you forget about the Morehead College case was, there was no corrupt prosecutor trying to stir up racial animosity against hh accused

kenhyderal said...

Dr. Harr I am patiently awaiting for you to deal with the violators of the blog's rules on August 3rd. and 4th.

Anonymous said...

KENHYDERAL:

"Dr. Harr I am patiently awaiting for you to deal with the violators of the blog's rules on August 3rd. and 4th."

Enjoy the wait.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

With regard to the media and the Morehead College incident, the question is why the black media and black leaders(al, jesse, the NAACP) did not make an issue out of it.

The reason is the incident could not be used to stir up black resentment towards white people, i.e. practice black on white racism.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

Are you saying that someone has the right to break into another's domicile and commit grand larceny and then not expect that other person not to get angry about that?

The other person does not have a right to take the law into his own hands. However, under the law, a person who provokes an attack upon himself can not plead self defense if he kills the attacker. I say that is especially true when the person uses an illegally possessed firearm to kill the attacker he provoked.

I say again, just like you left out significant parts of the Reginald Daye story, you left out significant parts of the Shan Carter story.

Nifong Supporter said...


Lance the Supreme Poster of Enlightenment said...
"First, even thugs deserve to be treated with justice... and I do not concede that Shan Carter is a thug with that statement."

Shan Carter is an admitted drug pusher, thief, and with the death of Demetrius Greene, killer.

He also has a prior conviction for murder, robbery, and kidnapping.

What, in your mind Sid, determines whether a person is a thug?


First of all, the murder conviction against Carter in the death of Donald Brunson is flawed... Shan should never have been charged with that crime, much less convicted. There was no physical evidence linking him to the crime... the only thing prosecutors used was prior contradictory statements made by his wife. Not only that, but prosecutors withheld DNA hair evidence that would've been exculpatory.

You are correct that prosecutors used the bogus murder charge in the Brunson case in order to persuade jurors to come up with a death penalty verdict to retaliate against Carter for Demetrius Green's death. That is not the way our justice system should work.

Nifong Supporter said...


kenhyderal said...
Dr. Harr: Invoke the "kenhyderal rule" or I'm out of here.


For the past two weeks, I have been out of town, just returning today. The kenhyderal policy is in effect and has been used frequently... First, however, I need to be aware of the offense. Don't hesitate to point them out to me. I will also extend the rule to include narratives that are not comprehensible by English speaking people. Languages in Russian or using Chinese characters will be subjected to deletion.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

"First of all, the murder conviction against Carter in the death of Donald Brunson is flawed... Shan should never have been charged with that crime, much less convicted. There was no physical evidence linking him to the crime... the only thing prosecutors used was prior contradictory statements made by his wife. Not only that, but prosecutors withheld DNA hair evidence that would've been exculpatory."

There was more to Shan Carter's record as a violent criminal than the murder of Donald Brunson.

"You are correct that prosecutors used the bogus murder charge in the Brunson case in order to persuade jurors to come up with a death penalty verdict to retaliate against Carter for Demetrius Green's death. That is not the way our justice system should work."

You say that the way the justice system should work is that a black man, who killed Tyrone Baker and Demetrius Green with an illegally possessed firearm while pursuing Tyrone Baker should get a pass felony murder.or f

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

"

For the past two weeks, I have been out of town, just returning today. The kenhyderal policy is in effect and has been used frequently... First, however, I need to be aware of the offense. Don't hesitate to point them out to me. I will also extend the rule to include narratives that are not comprehensible by English speaking people. Languages in Russian or using Chinese characters will be subjected to deletion."

The "Kenhyderal rule" is, don't let KENHYDERAL be exposed to certain truths, e.g. black on white racism exists, Crystal Mangum fabricate her story of being raped.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

"prosecutors used the bogus murder charge in the Brunson case in order to persuade jurors to come up with a death penalty verdict to retaliate against Carter for Demetrius Green's death."

And the facts, that Shan Carter shot and killed Demetrius Green while pursuing and firing an illegally possessed firearm at a man who was fleeing him should not count.

HARRIAN Justice: If a black man does it, it is not a crime.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

According to you, Tyrone Baker made no threatening move against Shan Carter. He approached Shan Carter with a coat draped over his hand.

Basically the incident happened because Shan Carter interpreted Tyrone Baker's moves as threatening. If point of fact, Tyrone Baker made no threatening move before Shan Carter started firing. That does not support a defense of self defense.

Lance the Supreme Poster of Enlightenment said...

Sid -- Here I will simply note that you did not answer my question.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

The facts you present to support Shan Carter's claim of self defense indicate that Shan Carter made the first offensive move and then continued to make offensive moves against Tyrone Baker. Consult Professor Coleman if you like, but I think that is self defense. It is more like, if Tyrone tries to get his money back, I am going to blow him away.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

Correction of typo:



The facts you present to support Shan Carter's claim of self defense indicate that Shan Carter made the first offensive move and then continued to make offensive moves against Tyrone Baker. Consult Professor Coleman if you like, but I think that IS NOT self defense. It is more like, if Tyrone tries to get his money back, I am going to blow him away.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR(and anyone else for that matter):

When you read my comment of August 8, 2013 at 1:40 PM, be sure to read the following comment of August 8, 2013 at 1:41 PM.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

This is the story which your "facts" really presents:

Shan Carter breaks into and robs Tyrone Baker's apartment. Later while Shan Carter is dealing illegal drugs on the street, he sees Tyrone Baker. He draws a gun he illegally possesses and opens fire on Tyrone Baker. Tyrone Baker flees. Shan Carter pursues and keeps firing a him. Shan Carter kills Tyrone Baker and Demetris Green. When charged with two counts of felony murder(and there was more than enough probable cause to charge him), Shan Carter pleads self defense.

SIDNEY, who believes that it isn't a crime when a black man commits a crime, then says he is not a thug.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

From http://caselaw.findlaw.com/nc-supreme-court/1339721.html, a record of Shan Carter's appeal:

"In late 1996, defendant was involved in a number of break-ins and burglaries in Wilmington, North Carolina, including one at the home of Keith Lamont Richardson...Richardson subsequently saw defendant on the street and angrily confronted him about the break-in. During the confrontation, defendant drew a chrome .357 caliber revolver and Richardson fled. Defendant fired several shots, wounding Richardson's arm."

That establishes Shan Carter's aggressive nature, a willingness to shoot people who confronted him about his illegal activity.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

From the same URL:

"As Baker ran down 10th Street, defendant followed him around the corner, continuing to fire between four and six shots.   At some point, Baker ran in front of or near the Greene car in an attempt to cross 10th Street.   During the course of the shooting, two of the bullets from defendant's revolver struck Baker, one in the leg and one in the torso.   Baker staggered across the street, collapsed in a grassy area near the sidewalk, and died shortly thereafter.   A stray bullet from defendant's revolver passed through the windshield of D'April Greene's car and struck Demetrius Greene in the head."

Shan Carter was not acting defensively. He was trying to blow Tyrone Baker away. In the course of doing that, he killed Demetrius Green.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

This is what your logic implies:

A thief steals someone's property. The rightful owner wants to recover his property.

You believe the thief has a right to use force to prevent the rightful owner from recovering the property. If the thief says he believes the rightful owner might kill him, that makes it self defense.

Anonymous said...

Ken-ny, Ken-ny, Ken-ny, Ken-ny

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

When you give your presentation on Shan Carter, are you going to highlights which made him already a convicted felon when he killed Tyrone Baker and Demetrius Green.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

Your attitude towards Demetrius Green seems to be he was unfortunate collateral damage to Shan Carter's quest to protect his ill gotten gains from robbing Tyrone Baker.

Another demonstration of your obvious absolute lack of any sense of morality.

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

Factoring in your postings on the phony Duke Rape case, you seem to believe the police have a duty to protect black criminals when they perpetrate their crimes, even if it means convicting innocent men.

And you expect people to believe you are a follower of the Man from Nazareth?

HUH!!!

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

Check this out:

http://s1.zetaboards.com/Liestoppers_meeting/topic/5202008/1/

There is some info about your girl Victoria Peterson(Victory Poo Poo according to your obsession Honey Boo Boo-isn't that precious).

Anonymous said...

SIDNEY HARR:

The Man from Nazareth told Peter to put away his sword after Peter went after the servant of the High Priest.

What would the Man from Nazareth have told Shan Carter when Shan Carter drew his gun?

Maybe, put away your gun lest someone innocent gets hurt.

Nifong Supporter said...


Anonymous said...
SIDNEY HARR:

"First of all, the murder conviction against Carter in the death of Donald Brunson is flawed... Shan should never have been charged with that crime, much less convicted. There was no physical evidence linking him to the crime... the only thing prosecutors used was prior contradictory statements made by his wife. Not only that, but prosecutors withheld DNA hair evidence that would've been exculpatory."

There was more to Shan Carter's record as a violent criminal than the murder of Donald Brunson.

"You are correct that prosecutors used the bogus murder charge in the Brunson case in order to persuade jurors to come up with a death penalty verdict to retaliate against Carter for Demetrius Green's death. That is not the way our justice system should work."

You say that the way the justice system should work is that a black man, who killed Tyrone Baker and Demetrius Green with an illegally possessed firearm while pursuing Tyrone Baker should get a pass felony murder.or f


No... What I'm saying is that there is a difference between premeditated murder and self-defense. Shan clearly killed Baker in self-defense. It's that simple.

Nifong Supporter said...


Anonymous said...
SIDNEY HARR:

The Man from Nazareth told Peter to put away his sword after Peter went after the servant of the High Priest.

What would the Man from Nazareth have told Shan Carter when Shan Carter drew his gun?

Maybe, put away your gun lest someone innocent gets hurt.


What Shan's situation boiled down to when Baker came after Carter was: kill or be killed.

Is it your position that Shan should have not attempted to defend himself and allowed a New York drug dealer to kill him because he was angry that Shan stole his money?


My position is that Carter was within his rights to protect himself by shooting Baker.

Nifong Supporter said...


Anonymous said...
SIDNEY HARR:

Your attitude towards Demetrius Green seems to be he was unfortunate collateral damage to Shan Carter's quest to protect his ill gotten gains from robbing Tyrone Baker.

Another demonstration of your obvious absolute lack of any sense of morality.


Your premise is misleading itself. By shooting Baker, Carter was not trying to protect his "ill gotten gains," rather he shot Baker to protect his life. Remember... this is a self-defense case.

Nifong Supporter said...


Anonymous said...
SIDNEY HARR:

This is what your logic implies:

A thief steals someone's property. The rightful owner wants to recover his property.

You believe the thief has a right to use force to prevent the rightful owner from recovering the property. If the thief says he believes the rightful owner might kill him, that makes it self defense.


Misleading premise! The rightful owner of the money stolen isn't seeking to recover it, he's seeking retribution by killing those responsible for the theft. Baker made that clear throughout the community. Shan knew that he was being targeted by Baker prior to the incident. He also was aware that the other two participants in the theft had been assaulted by Baker. Carter took prudent and justifiable action in shooting Baker (although his aim was off and instead of wounding Baker he inflicted a fatal injury).

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