justice4nifong: Was Reginald Daye's death a murder or an accident?

Sunday, February 8, 2015

Was Reginald Daye's death a murder or an accident?

Click to access 'Grievance filed with State Bar against Ann B. Petersen'

322 comments:

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Anonymous said...: Anonymous 12:22:

Why do you rely on ad hominem attacks? Try to convince someone with credible arguments.

is wasn't an ad hominem attack - it was a defense - sorry you didn't get that ... but i'm not gonna spell it out for ya

Why don't you analyze the medical reports and relate them to the legal doctrine contained in Welch, Holsclaw, Jones and other cases? Because that gets me no where when I have to look at this case from the reference of their medical reports and ever trusting them again after watching what they did (or didn't do) in this case ... simply doesn't ... never will ... and that is really all that matters to me from a patient's point of view.; February 16, 2015 at 1:26 PM
guiowen said...: To the 1:26,
I don't think any of us really care what matters to you.; February 16, 2015 at 3:13 PM
Anonymous said...: gee g..., how evil duke trollish of you to assume that, what manners you must possess to say such a thing, and how unrealistic of you to not see that I am but one of many patients, (or realistically - potential patients), who may feel the same way about duke and trust and this case.; February 16, 2015 at 3:49 PM
Anonymous said...: Anonymous 1:26:

I characterized your earlier post as an ad hominem attack because it was an ad hominem attack.

You may not realize this, but Mangum's murder case is a criminal case. As a result, the law matters. The law is best understood in reviewing prior cases in which principles are discussed. A review of the medical reports is only part of the analysis.; February 16, 2015 at 3:55 PM
Anonymous said...: If they are going to charge murder, doesn't a convinction need proof beyond resonable doubt, per law? So if it was murder, then the evidence says complications, (which was the deadly intubation errors), caused death. Whether the intubation errors was a direct cause of the stab wound is the real question then - one which has never been aswered beyond reasonable doubt to comply with law. In fact, going against the law, the intubation error has been kept from the jury and judges in very obvious ways.

There is no reason to ignore the corruption, discrepancies, and legal errors unless someone has a duke, ME, or justice system conflict. The law applies to those identities, although obviously those identities seem to apply it only to fit their own benefit or agendas.

Actually it was a defense - either you get attacked everytime you post on this blog from one or other of the evil duke troll gang and don't eventually start to defend yourself from them, or go complain about someone else doing it elsewhere ... thanks.

blah; February 16, 2015 at 4:14 PM
Anonymous said...: No. It was not defense. Walt provided an analysis of his interpretation of the law. You responded, not by providing an alternative, but by calling him names. That is an ad hominem attack.; February 16, 2015 at 4:18 PM
guiowen said...: In fact a jury of twelve felt that it was proved beyond reasonable doubt. That's what matters.; February 16, 2015 at 4:18 PM
Anonymous said...: ... if Walt hadn't done the same thing a thousand other times and left out the obvious from the duke medical reports and the contradictions in the autopsy reports in relation to duke reports one too many times perhaps ... but that is not the case.

The jury was rigged with the wife of duke surgeon - complete with an admonition to make sure to make durham (re: duke)look 'good' to the jury - what does the law say about that?; February 16, 2015 at 4:31 PM
Anonymous said...: No. It was an ad hominem attack. Why don't you analyze the count cases -- Welch, Holsclaw, Jones and others -- and how they relate to this case.

Walt has discussed the medical records previously. He has focused on the conclusions reached by both Nichols and Roberts and how the law addresses malpractice.

You limit your arguments to calling your critics names.; February 16, 2015 at 4:43 PM
Anonymous said...: Where is Kenny? Has he abandoned his dear friend? Is he in his bedroom master debating?; February 16, 2015 at 5:31 PM
Walt said...: Sid wrote: "And just like Drs. Nichols and Roberts, you cannot give a distinct narrative of how the stab wound to Daye's left side caused Daye's brain death. Nobody can provide such a nexus between the stab wound and Daye's brain death or actual death without mentioning the esophageal intubation."

Actually, two real physicians did. Dr. Roberts and the Medical Examiner. Their opinions matter, because in the case of the M.E. he examined the body and drew his conclusions. In the case of Roberts, she examined the records and reached her conclusion. Sid, you are not a licensed physician, thus you are not reliable as an expert. You did not treat Daye, nor have you ever laid eyes on him, thus you cannot gave any factual evidence at all. The two physicians who have the expertise have reached the same conclusion. Daye died as a result of stab wounds inflicted by Crystal Mangum.

Further, their conclusions are supported by the law in this state and every other. Medical malpractice, if it took place, is not an intervening cause unless it is the sole cause of death. In this case, Roberts and Nichols are quite correct legally too. Had Daye not been in the hospital as a result of Crystal's stabbing him, he would not have needed to be intubated. Thus, his death is the proximate result of being stabbed by Crystal.

Walt-in-Durham; February 17, 2015 at 9:20 AM
Walt said...: Anonymous at 1:26 PM wrote: " that is really all that matters to me from a patient's point of view."

Since you, allegedly, are concerned about public health, why don't you quote the statistical reports that show DUHS or DRH or DCH are a great danger to their patients? .....[crickets chirping]..... Oh, because those reports show that DUHS, DRH and DCH have outcomes comparable to other teaching hospitals. Because those reports show that teaching hospitals have better outcomes than community hospitals in all areas but one, hospital infections. Oh, and you could complain about hospital infections, but then you would have to address the thorny question of why all teaching hospitals have hospital infection problems, not better nor worse than Duke's.

Walt-in-Durham; February 17, 2015 at 9:25 AM
Anonymous said...: seriously?

why?

what in the world does anything you just said have anything to do with this blog, this case, or the discussion at hand?

???; February 17, 2015 at 9:57 AM
Lance the Intern said...: In the FWIW dept:

The 2014-15 U.S. News & World Report rankings placed Duke University Medical Center among the top hospitals in the nation.

Also in 2014, Triangle residents rated Duke University Medical Center as the best-quality hospital in the Raleigh-Durham metropolitan area. Duke University Medical Center also was again ranked No. 1 in North Carolina.

From a patient's point of view, if I need medical care I want the best care available. Obviously, for Triangle residents, this is DUMC.; February 17, 2015 at 9:59 AM
Lance the Intern said...: Anonymous @ 9:57 stated:
"seriously?
why?
what in the world does anything you just said have anything to do with this blog, this case, or the discussion at hand?
???"

Are you the same Anonymous that posted yesterday @ 1:26?

If so, then you know why Walt made his comments.

If not, I suggest you go read the comments Anonymous made yesterday @ 1:26, then you'll understand why Walt made these comments; February 17, 2015 at 10:05 AM
Anonymous said...: no shit

that is why it is even more maddening that they ruin that rating with the sort of corrupt crap they have pulled in these cases, this one especially

and how does anyone trust those rating when they come to realize that duke is just a bunch of big fat liars and corrupt the system to hide facts they do not want known (that might hurt those ratings, irregardless of how much they harm others)? eh?; February 17, 2015 at 10:06 AM
Lance the Intern said...: DUMC has been ranked as the best-quality hospital in the Raleigh-Durham metropolitan area for 14 years.

Apparently there is no "corrupt crap" from DUMC to ruin the ratings.

Nice try, though.; February 17, 2015 at 10:14 AM
Anonymous said...: No decision from the Court of Appeals today ... the next decision day is March 3. They normally take 60-90 days, so April is a more realistic timeframe.

What is sad - IF Crystal gets a new trial, she's gonna be so brainwashed by Sid and Kenny that she will likely represent herself. Fortunately for her, she can do no worse than 2nd Degree under the law.; February 17, 2015 at 10:16 AM
Lance the Intern said...: Thanks for the update, Anonymous@10:16; February 17, 2015 at 10:18 AM
Anonymous said...: seriously?

This case clearly demonstrates how corrupted the system is when it involves Duke.

It is the same corrupted system that's been around for the past 14 years or more that you are touting those rankings on.

Quess the ratings mean more than the reality of the corruption employed to achieve them eh (if you are manipulated by those sorts of things - which many are).; February 17, 2015 at 10:20 AM
Lance the Intern said...: "Quess[sic] the ratings mean more than the reality of the corruption employed to achieve them eh"

I think you mean "Guess" here, but I'm really not sure.

But....The people who ranked DUMC as the best-quality hospital in the Raleigh-Durham metropolitan area were....Triangle residents.

You speak of "corruption employed to achieve" these ratings. What corruption has DUMC employed over the last 14 years to convince the entire Triangle population that they are the best quality hospital?; February 17, 2015 at 10:30 AM
Anonymous said...: The lacrosse players have certainly been complaining lots about the same the system i'm talking about, and this case is just an in your face corruption and the devil be damned, business as usual type demonstration of the same.; February 17, 2015 at 10:37 AM
Lance the Intern said...: "The lacrosse players have certainly been complaining lots about the same the system i'm talking about, and this case is just an in your face corruption and the devil be damned, business as usual type demonstration of the same."

Was this in response to my last post? If so, I can't find any instance of Lacrosse players complaining about DUMC.
And could you clarify what you mean by "the same the system" and "this case"?; February 17, 2015 at 10:42 AM
Anonymous said...: no lance, you've been on this blog way longer than i, but yet i know what system this blog refers to ... hmmmmmmmmmm

you like to argue - great - if your in a room - choose any wall and have your say

blah; February 17, 2015 at 10:46 AM
Anonymous said...: Actually, Lance, there were complaints from lacrosse players relating to the SANE exam. As you recall, Levicy's comments to Gottlieb gave legs to the attempted frame. Neither Levicy, nor her supervisors (e.g., Arico) corrected Levicy's initial mischaracterization.; February 17, 2015 at 10:48 AM
Lance the Intern said...: In other words, you have no sound reasoning for your comments.

Hmmmmmmmmmm.

Blah, indeed.; February 17, 2015 at 10:49 AM
Lance the Intern said...: "Lance, there were complaints from lacrosse players relating to the SANE exam"

I thought Anonymous @10:37 was referring to recent complaints, due to the use of the present indicative "have certainly been complaining".; February 17, 2015 at 11:02 AM
Fake Kenhyderal said...: ...Or is that present perfect?; February 17, 2015 at 11:04 AM
Your 8th Grade English Teacher said...: It's Present Perfect Progressive Tense....; February 17, 2015 at 11:07 AM
Anonymous said...: Walt,

If you adhere to the ranking system Duke has in place to rank itself number one, then why do you continually refuse to acknowledge what duke themselves say in their own medical records in this case?

That is my complaint against you in this discussion. You are not even looking at the facts, you are being blindingly one dimensional in your legal analysis of the case. On this blog, where many of the realities of this case are documented, not just the one dimension you focus on, what you say in your one dimensionally reasoned posts is obvious in its lack of reasonable perception of the facts.

...and then you try to win the argument by mocking those who see more clearly, and get your goon squad to attack if there is any protest.

You do it all the time.
Why?; February 17, 2015 at 11:14 AM
Anonymous said...: Have you asked the Duke doctors about the discrepancies in the medical records?

Kenny and Sid keep asking questions and claiming all the defense attorneys were incompetent because they haven't asked those questions.

In reality, I am sure the attorneys asked all the questions and know the answers were harmful to Crystal, and since Duke wasn't on trial, decided to keep them out. You can either believe that everyone but Sid and Kenny are in a conspiracy against Crystal (a conspiracy for which there is no evidence), or you can believe they did their jobs, and have information they have just declined to share with Kenny and Sid because there is no reason to do so.

Of course, no one will ask the attorneys - because they don't want to be proven wrong - they like to tilt at windmills and stoke their own egos.

Other than Sid, Kenny, and Tin-Foil, no one really takes anything they say seriously. They are jokes, this blog is a joke, and it's sad how they are destroying Crystal to further their own egos.; February 17, 2015 at 11:18 AM
Lance the Intern said...: "...the ranking system Duke has in place to rank itself number one"

Are you saying Duke created the U.S. News & World Report rankings? I'm sure that comes as a surprise to Mort Zuckerman....; February 17, 2015 at 11:33 AM
Lance the Intern said...: Forgot to mention:

Proud member of the Walt-In-Durham Goon Squad since 2009.; February 17, 2015 at 11:39 AM
kenhyderal said...: This comment has been removed by the author.; February 17, 2015 at 2:23 PM
kenhyderal said...: Perhaps also one of The Liestopper "Blog Hooligans" dedicated to destroying Crystal, DA Nifong and anyone else who dared to accuse entitled sons of privilege.; February 17, 2015 at 2:27 PM
Fake Kenhyderal said...: Kenny -- Are the "entitled sons of privilege" the same people who were victims of Duke's corrupt practices per Anonymous?; February 17, 2015 at 2:41 PM
Lance the Intern said...: Kenhyderal -- You are incorrect. But thanks for playing.; February 17, 2015 at 2:51 PM
kenhyderal said...: I'll leave the judging of Duke's Medical competence to those more qualified then me. What I will question is them either unethically covering up the incidence of medical malpractice that killed Daye or perhaps admitting it to Daye's Family, compensating them and at the same time immorally allowing Crystal to be convicted of what they did. It appears they are willing to protect their image at the expense of those they deem inconsequential.; February 17, 2015 at 2:56 PM
kenhyderal said...: Lance said: "You are incorrect"............ I'm glad to hear your denial. You do seem a lot less fanatical then them; February 17, 2015 at 3:00 PM
Lance the Intern said...: Fanatical: obsessively concerned with something.

I'll leave it to the readers to determine who is fanatical and who is not.; February 17, 2015 at 3:03 PM
Anonymous said...: Kenny,

Are the "entitled sons of privilege" entitled to due process? Was Nifong justified in prosecuting them without credible evidence?; February 17, 2015 at 4:41 PM
John D. Smith said...: Kenny,

Did DUMC cover up their malpractice if they disclosed it in their medical records?

What is their responsibility if both the prosecution and the defense concluded that the malpractice did not cut off Mangum's legal liability? I agree that medical professionals must answer questions in interviews and in testimony accurately and truthfully. What are the requirements beyond that?

John D. Smith
New York, NY; February 17, 2015 at 4:50 PM
Anonymous said...: When a person dies from having a knife plunged into their body you can be pretty sure it's not an accident.Crystal should be happy with a very lenient 14 year sentence but when she gets out I'm sure she'll get in trouble again just like O.J.; February 17, 2015 at 6:40 PM
Anonymous said...: kenny:

If someone is an "entitled son of privilege" does that make it okay to accuse them of a crime that didn't happen? What exactly is an "entitled son of privilege?" Who makes such a determination? What are the criteria for being an "entitled son of privilege?" What other rights and civil iiberties should someone lose once it has been determined that they are an "entitled son of privilege?" Finally, do you possess enough self awareness to know how incredibly nutty you sound?

Abe Froman
Chicago, IL; February 17, 2015 at 7:20 PM
kenhyderal said...: Anonymous said... " Kenny, Are the "entitled sons of privilege" entitled to due process? Was Nifong justified in prosecuting them without credible evidence".... They got not only due process but also, with pressure and influence, a review of the case by the highest law enforcement agent in the State who declared then innocent but who would not reveal the details of his investigation; February 17, 2015 at 9:27 PM
kenhyderal said...: John D. Smith said" I agree that medical professionals must answer questions in interviews and in testimony accurately and truthfully. What are the requirements beyond that"... The medical records indicate what happened but made no admission that it was a gross and lethal example of medical malpractice. I agree medical professionals including all who treated Daye must testify; February 17, 2015 at 9:33 PM
Anonymous said...: What kenhydral posted is false.AG Roy Cooper issued a public report detailing why Crystal's ridiculous allegations of being gang raped in a bathroom that was too small were impossible.He declared the lacrosse players innocence because the crime never happened.None of the young men at the party would have wanted to have sex with her.; February 17, 2015 at 9:43 PM
John D. Smith said...: Kenny,

You mischaracterized what I said. I did not say that I believed that all medical professionals must testify. I said only that if called, they must testify truthfully and accurately.

I also implied that if the defense did not believe that the malpractice cut off legally liability, they may not be called to testify.

I note that you failed to answer any of the questions I asked.

John D. Smith
New York, NY; February 17, 2015 at 10:01 PM
Anonymous said...: Cooper issued a report that provided a fair amount of the "details of his investigation." Although Cooper did not release the investigative file, with the exception of Crystal's 1,000 page mental health records, most of the key pieces of evidence are public.

Kenny, I ask that you apologize for your inaccurate comment at 9:27. That comment could only be taken as a deliberate attempt on your part to mislead other readers.; February 17, 2015 at 10:06 PM
Anonymous said...: Kenny is a liar.; February 17, 2015 at 10:08 PM
Anonymous said...: Kenny,

Where is your apology?; February 17, 2015 at 10:23 PM
Walt said...: Anonymous at 10:06 PM wrote: "Cooper issued a report that provided a fair amount of the "details of his investigation." Although Cooper did not release the investigative file, with the exception of Crystal's 1,000 page mental health records, most of the key pieces of evidence are public.

Kenny, I ask that you apologize for your inaccurate comment at 9:27. That comment could only be taken as a deliberate attempt on your part to mislead other readers."

DING-DING-DING, Ladies and Gentlemen, we have a winner!

Walt-in-Durham; February 18, 2015 at 6:05 AM
Walt said...: Kenhyderal wrote: "They got not only due process but also, with pressure and influence, a review of the case by the highest law enforcement agent in the State who declared then innocent but who would not reveal the details of his investigation."

Wrong on both counts. (1) Nifong withdrew from the case. Under our law, the Attorney General steps in for any D.A. who withdraws.

(2) Cooper's special prosecutors did reveal the details of their investigation except for Crystal's mental health record.

Walt-in-Durham; February 18, 2015 at 6:08 AM
Walt said...: Anonymous at 9:43 PM, the last sentence of your comment is uncalled for and disgusting.

Walt-in-Durham; February 18, 2015 at 6:10 AM
Nifong Supporter said...: Anonymous Anonymous said...
If they are going to charge murder, doesn't a convinction need proof beyond resonable doubt, per law? So if it was murder, then the evidence says complications, (which was the deadly intubation errors), caused death. Whether the intubation errors was a direct cause of the stab wound is the real question then - one which has never been aswered beyond reasonable doubt to comply with law. In fact, going against the law, the intubation error has been kept from the jury and judges in very obvious ways.

There is no reason to ignore the corruption, discrepancies, and legal errors unless someone has a duke, ME, or justice system conflict. The law applies to those identities, although obviously those identities seem to apply it only to fit their own benefit or agendas.

Actually it was a defense - either you get attacked everytime you post on this blog from one or other of the evil duke troll gang and don't eventually start to defend yourself from them, or go complain about someone else doing it elsewhere ... thanks.

blah

Always good to see comments from enlightened viewers of this blog site. You are absolutely correct in your assessment... It is obvious that Dr. Nichols and Roberts dance around the so-called complication to the stab wound... the esophageal intubation. Of course, we know that the intubation was not a complication of the stab wound at all... if anything, it had to do with Daye's delirium tremens. There's no way to get around the esophageal intubation when discussing Daye's death, but that is something that everyone refuses to mention.; February 18, 2015 at 9:40 AM
Nifong Supporter said...: John D. Smith said...
Kenny,

You mischaracterized what I said. I did not say that I believed that all medical professionals must testify. I said only that if called, they must testify truthfully and accurately.

I also implied that if the defense did not believe that the malpractice cut off legally liability, they may not be called to testify.

I note that you failed to answer any of the questions I asked.

John D. Smith
New York, NY

Hey, Mr. Smith.

The esophageal intubation medical malpractice definitely did relieve Mangum of any liability in Daye's death as it was the intervening and proximate cause of his death... the direct cause of his brain death. Any fair and responsible physician would've testified as such.

Keep in mind that the Defense of Crystal had as its top priority to protect Duke University Hospital and not having Mangum acquitted. That was never the intention of any of Mangum's turncoat attorneys.; February 18, 2015 at 9:45 AM
Nifong Supporter said...: Anonymous Anonymous said...
When a person dies from having a knife plunged into their body you can be pretty sure it's not an accident.Crystal should be happy with a very lenient 14 year sentence but when she gets out I'm sure she'll get in trouble again just like O.J.

First of all, Daye didn't die because of the stab wound to his side. He died because he was taken off life-support for brain death due to esophageal intubation during treatment for signs of delirium tremens.

Unfortunately, you have not attained enlightenment status... you are in the hood-winked level of understanding. A major cause of that ailment is believing the mainstream media.; February 18, 2015 at 9:50 AM
Nifong Supporter said...: Lance the Intern said...
Forgot to mention:

Proud member of the Walt-In-Durham Goon Squad since 2009.

Hey, Lance.

I didn't know that Walt had a Goon Squad. If you'd've joined the Committee on Justice for Mike Nifong (founded in 2008), you'd at least have a free tee shirt.; February 18, 2015 at 9:54 AM
Lance the Intern said...: Dr. Harr -- I don't think Walt knew he had a good squad until Anonymous @ 11:14 AM from February 17 mentioned them.

The comment was really made to irritate our Anonymous poster.

In the spirit of Groucho Marx, I don’t care to belong to any club that will have me as a member.; February 18, 2015 at 11:31 AM
Lance the Intern said...: "good squad" should've read "goon squad"

Or maybe it was a Freudian slip....; February 18, 2015 at 11:33 AM
kenhyderal said...: Anonymous said: "Kenny, I ask that you apologize for your inaccurate comment at 9:27. That comment could only be taken as a deliberate attempt on your part to mislead other readers'.............AG Cooper's investigation by Winstead and Coman was done in secret and attempts to view the investigation notes by investigative author Wm. Cohan have been thwarted. Bringing up Crystal's private medical records in this context is disingenuous and a red herring.; February 18, 2015 at 3:45 PM
Anonymous said...: All criminal investifigations are done in secret.

North Carolina law does not permit the release of the discovery file.

The comment about Crystal's private medical records is not a red herring. That is the most significant piece of evidence not public.

Her medical history may explain why she was not charged. I note that I support Cooper's decision not to charge her.

What evidence is missing?; February 18, 2015 at 4:04 PM
Anonymous said...: Kenny is a liar.; February 18, 2015 at 4:05 PM
kenhyderal said...: Anonymous said: "What evidence is missing" .........Evidence gathered, that justified AG Cooper declaring the accused as "innocent"; February 18, 2015 at 4:32 PM
Walt said...: Sid wrote: "The esophageal intubation medical malpractice definitely did relieve Mangum of any liability in Daye's death as it was the intervening and proximate cause of his death... the direct cause of his brain death. Any fair and responsible physician would've testified as such."

Wrong Sid. Two fair and responsible physicians opined differently.

Walt-in-Durham; February 18, 2015 at 4:33 PM
Walt said...: Kenhyderal wrote: "What evidence is missing" .........Evidence gathered, that justified AG Cooper declaring the accused as "innocent""

Once again, you ignore the report and the body of evidence made public. The DNA alone proves the defendants were innocent. The alibi testimony puts Seligman far away from the place at the time Crystal untruthfully alleges something took place.

Walt-in-Durham; February 18, 2015 at 4:36 PM
Anonymous said...: Kenny,

I guess you didn't read the report. The special prosecutors concluded that there was no evidence that the crimes with which they had been charged had even occurred and there was additional evidence that those crimes had not occurred.

They summarized that evidence. What is missing?; February 18, 2015 at 4:48 PM
Anonymous said...: Kenny,

Why do you refer to Cohan as an "investigative reporter?"

He conducted no investigation. Other than his interviews of Nifong, Nifong's attorney and Crystal and his attempt to convince Cooper,to break state law, he simply regurgitated media reports.; February 18, 2015 at 5:15 PM
Anonymous said...: "Innocent."; February 18, 2015 at 5:53 PM
John D. Smith said...: Dr. Harr,

The esophageal intubation medical malpractice definitely did relieve Mangum of any liability in Daye's death as it was the intervening and proximate cause of his death... The direct cause of his brain death.

Thank you. I understand your opinion.

However, I am not a doctor, have no medical training and, because I am not a doctor, do not have access to a medical library. As a result, I rely on expert opinion.

Two experts concluded that Daye's death was an indirect result of the stabbing: Although the esophageal intubation was the direct cause of brain death, it was not an intervening cause for which Mangum was relieved of legal liability for his death.

Nichols' work was sloppy and incomplete, raising concerns about his accuracy and credibility. Roberts addressed those concerns. No credible evidence impeaches Roberts.

Although you are a retired physician, you are not an expert. You are a personal friend of Mangum. This friendship may bias your judgment. Finally, you frequently say what supports your opinion, not what is consistent with the facts (e.g., your mischaracterization of the lack of DNA as "not exculpatory"). As a result, your opinion is less reliable than the experts'.

Can you provide links to experts who support your opinion? Thanks.

John D. Smith
New York, NY; February 18, 2015 at 6:23 PM
Anonymous said...: The only experts needed at this point are the actual duke doctors who killed Mr. Daye. They are needed on the stand, in a fair and equal trial, to explain why exactly they killed Mr. Daye and then waited this long to admit it was their fault (nothing to do with the stab wound) while Ms. Mangum was incarcerated for their medical malpractice they could have prevented, but didn't for some odd reason.; February 18, 2015 at 6:53 PM
Anonymous said...: You are an idiot - your issues and explanations as to why the duke docs weren't called have been provided. Do you know you are an idiot or are you so stupid you actually don't realize it?; February 18, 2015 at 8:28 PM
Anonymous said...: Kenny,

Where is your apology?

You lied in your reply to me. You deliberately attempted to deceive the readers on this blog.; February 18, 2015 at 8:39 PM
guiowen said...: While you're at it, you should arrest Dick Broadhead and try him for allowing these murderers to work at Duke Hospital. You should then call all the members of the Board of Trustees of Duke University and try them for allowing someone like Broadhead to run the school.; February 18, 2015 at 8:39 PM
kenhyderal said...: Anonymous said: "You lied in your reply to me"........ What was the lie?; February 18, 2015 at 9:37 PM
kenhyderal said...: Walt said: "The alibi testimony puts Seligman far away from the place at the time Crystal untruthfully alleges something took place"......... Timelines based on selective sources are unreliable.; February 18, 2015 at 9:44 PM
kenhyderal said...: Anonymous said: "They summarized that evidence. What is missing"........ The evidence they summarized.; February 18, 2015 at 9:52 PM
Anonymous said...: Kenny,

I will tell you what is missing: a specific discussion from you of why the special prosecutors report was not convincing.; February 18, 2015 at 9:59 PM
Anonymous said...: Kenny,

What specific evidence do you need to see?; February 18, 2015 at 10:02 PM
Anonymous said...: Kenny,

What was not convincing?; February 18, 2015 at 10:13 PM
Anonymous said...: Kenny,

Are time stamped pictures unreliable? Are time stamped ATM receipts unreliable? Are time stamped credit card,receipts,unreliable? When testimony is consistent with physical evidence, is the testimony still unreliable? Is all that evidence "selective sources" as you suggest?

Your 9:44 response was misleading.; February 18, 2015 at 10:19 PM
guiowen said...: Don't expect Kenhyderal to explain why this evidence is unreliable. He's very good at avoiding questions that he can't answer. He probably won a lot of debate this way, back in school. This is one of the reasons he's known as The Master Debater.; February 19, 2015 at 5:49 AM
Walt said...: Kenhyderal wrote: "Timelines based on selective sources are unreliable."

I suppose DNA evidence is unreliable too. But, you want me to believe identifications from a very unreliable procedure are to be believed? No, that's not the way it works. The AG's report lays out the facts and it is abundantly clear that Reid Seligman, David Evans and Colin Finnerty are innocent. It is also abundantly clear that Crystal made false allegations. She may not understand the difference between the truth and a lie, but her allegations are untrue.

Walt-in-Durham; February 19, 2015 at 6:25 AM
John D. Smith said...: Walt,

I believe what Kenny wants us to accept is that in the lacrosse case, all exculpatory evidence is unreliable and all incubatory evidence is reliable. Moreover, all evidence that he imagines exists but has not seen is inculpatory.

In Mangum's murder case, the reverse is true. All exculpatory evidence is reliable and all inculpatory evidence is unreliable. Moreover, all evidence that he imagines exists but has not seen is exculpatory.

John D. Smith
New York, NY; February 19, 2015 at 7:12 AM
Nifong Supporter said...: Lance the Intern said...
"good squad" should've read "goon squad"

Or maybe it was a Freudian slip....

No Freudian slip. Just a mistake. It should've read "Goon Squad."; February 19, 2015 at 7:24 AM
Nifong Supporter said...: Walt said...
Sid wrote: "The esophageal intubation medical malpractice definitely did relieve Mangum of any liability in Daye's death as it was the intervening and proximate cause of his death... the direct cause of his brain death. Any fair and responsible physician would've testified as such."

Wrong Sid. Two fair and responsible physicians opined differently.

Walt-in-Durham

"Fair and Rresponsible physicians?" C'mon now... Really, Walt!! Drs. Nichols and Roberts are as biased and corrupted as they come. You can't just take what they say on faith. They can't even determine whether or not Daye's spleen was removed at surgery... and whether or not the stomach was perforated... And Dr. Roberts conveniently neglected commenting about the scabbed over "defensive injuries" to Daye's left upper extremity.

Not only that, but neither of them can explain the steps leading to Daye's death without mentioning the esophageal intubation so they just skip from "he was stabbed" to "he died." What a joke.; February 19, 2015 at 7:30 AM
Nifong Supporter said...: John D. Smith said...
Dr. Harr,

The esophageal intubation medical malpractice definitely did relieve Mangum of any liability in Daye's death as it was the intervening and proximate cause of his death... The direct cause of his brain death.

Thank you. I understand your opinion.

However, I am not a doctor, have no medical training and, because I am not a doctor, do not have access to a medical library. As a result, I rely on expert opinion.

Two experts concluded that Daye's death was an indirect result of the stabbing: Although the esophageal intubation was the direct cause of brain death, it was not an intervening cause for which Mangum was relieved of legal liability for his death.

Nichols' work was sloppy and incomplete, raising concerns about his accuracy and credibility. Roberts addressed those concerns. No credible evidence impeaches Roberts.

Although you are a retired physician, you are not an expert. You are a personal friend of Mangum. This friendship may bias your judgment. Finally, you frequently say what supports your opinion, not what is consistent with the facts (e.g., your mischaracterization of the lack of DNA as "not exculpatory"). As a result, your opinion is less reliable than the experts'.

Can you provide links to experts who support your opinion? Thanks.

John D. Smith
New York, NY

Mr. Smith,

Dr. Robert did acknowledge that the initial intubation of Daye was esophageal... hard for her not to do so since the End Tidal CO2 monitor had a negative reading. However, she failed to provide a medical nexus between the stab wound and Daye's brain death or actual death when she concluded that she agreed with Dr. Nichols' conclusion. To state that the stab wound resulted in Daye being hospitalized has no bearing on the fact that potentially lethal esophageal intubation malpractice was the intervening cause of his brain death. Neither the stab wound itself nor any specific complication of the stab wound resulted in Daye's brain death... and Daye's irreversible brain death and comatose state was the reason he was removed from life-support and died. Ergo, his death had nothing to do with the stab wound which was successfully treated by surgeons during his operation the morning of April 3, 2011.

Dr. Roberts didn't expound on Daye's alleged "defensive injuries" to his left upper extremity... grossly negligent in her mandate as a defensive expert witness.

Regarding the spleen, it doesn't require a medical degree to understand that a problem exists when it comes to the status of Daye's spleen. Under oath Dr. Nichols testified twice that Daye's spleen was unavailable for examination at autopsy because it had been removed eleven days earlier during surgery... yet, he described the organ in his autopsy report. How do you explain that? Was Daye's spleen removed at surgery, or was Dr. Nichols committing perjury at trial with regards to the spleen's removal? Answer me that, Mr. Smith.; February 19, 2015 at 7:47 AM
John D. Smith said...: Dr. Harr,

Thank you for your response.

As I stated in my earlier comment, I am not a doctor. I cannot answer the question regarding the spleen except as speculation. I believe that the spleen had not been removed because it was described in the autopsy report. I believe Nichols answered incorrectly twice because of incompetence, not perjury.

I note that you ignored a significant part of my comment. I do not trust you and do not respect your opinion. I gave three reasons:

1. You are not an expert.
2. You are a friend of Mangum and may be biased.
3. Your earlier opinions on other subjects frequently have been proven incorrect.

The third reason is the most important. You have shown that you will either provide opinions without adequate knowledge or that you are a liar.

I do not accept the opinions or fools and liars.

John D. Smith
New York, NY; February 19, 2015 at 7:58 AM
Lance the Intern said...: "They can't even determine whether or not Daye's spleen was removed at surgery... and whether or not the stomach was perforated..."
And neither can you, as you never examined Mr. Daye's body. We are left to conclude that you also fall far short of the "fair and responsible" mark.; February 19, 2015 at 8:31 AM
kenhyderal said...: Walt said: "The AG's report lays out the facts"....... No it doesn't. The 7000 plus pages of documents, the 625 photographs, the 2 videos and the transcripts from the 47 interviews, that the conclusions were, supposedly, based on, were not released.; February 19, 2015 at 9:59 AM
Lance the Intern said...: " The 7000 plus pages of documents, the 625 photographs, the 2 videos and the transcripts from the 47 interviews, that the conclusions were, supposedly, based on, were not released."

How many times do you have to be told that North Carolina law does not permit the release of a discovery file?; February 19, 2015 at 10:09 AM
Walt said...: Kenhyderal wrote: "No it doesn't."

Yes it does. Read the report here: http://www.ncdoj.gov/getdoc/29748585-538e-43be-9de2-113628743d57/SummaryConclusions.aspx

He who asserts, must prove. You have failed to prove any of your claims or dispute any fact reported by the Attorney General.

Walt-in-Durham; February 19, 2015 at 10:45 AM
Anonymous said...: Neither did the AG.

Everyone must except his conclusions without any facts, evidence nor proof.

Probably why many don't believe him - and think him declaring the players innocent isn't professional nor does it mean anything - especially since all are innocent until proven guilty - and there was no trial and no proof that they are not guilty.

Then he went and stood with the president and the duke bb players for a photo shot.

Why did he do that after such a controversial case that he presided over?

Now he wants to be governor - so he ignores this latest corrupt Duke / Mangum case - not even giving a flip whether the public is safe from duke and the corrupt Duke / Durham justice system or the ME system or not.

Guess ya can't be governor without the backing of duke in NC.; February 19, 2015 at 11:19 AM
Lance the Intern said...: " especially since all are innocent until proven guilty - and there was no trial and no proof that they are not guilty."

I submit that you, Anonymous @ 11:19, are guilty of the rape of Crystal Gail Mangum in 2006, and the murder of Reginald Daye in 2011.

I await your trial so that you can prove your innocence.; February 19, 2015 at 11:48 AM
Anonymous said...: what a joke

you don't even make sense - at all

projecting again are ya?; February 19, 2015 at 12:04 PM
Lance the Intern said...: Not at all - I'm attempting to follow your statement to it's logical conclusion.

In your world, one requires proof and a trial to show that they are not guilty of a crime.

I submit that you committed not one, but two crimes.

Until you have your trial and prove your innocence, you are guilty.

But don't get mad at me -- I'm just holding you to the same standard you are holding the Duke LAX players.; February 19, 2015 at 12:15 PM
Anonymous said...: Someone let me know when Kenny or Sid says anything new and/or unpredictable. Until then, I'm done - this blog went from being a joke and source of some distraction to a pathetic delving into the mind of clearly mentally ill and sick individuals (Sid, Kenny, Tin Foil).; February 19, 2015 at 12:17 PM
Anonymous said...: wtf

no - i said all are innocent until proven quilty

there was national media harrassment of the entire nation, a grand jury decision, a DA who believed them quilty, a massive discovery file ... and everyone is supposed to believe a duke conflicted (corrupted?) AG who just says - oh their innocent - ya'll can quit getting harrassed by these duke lunatics now if ya just believe that

... but no, the duke / mangum saga continues

except this time duke is obviously wrong in its malpractice and the ME coverup of the same ... so the entire nation isn't being harrassed by their drama ... yet; February 19, 2015 at 12:24 PM
Lance the Intern said...: Actually, you stated:

"...specially since all are innocent until proven guilty - and there was no trial and no proof that they are not guilty."

If they are "innocent until proven guilty", there is no need to prove they are not guilty.; February 19, 2015 at 12:32 PM
Anonymous said...: obviously there was since they harrassed the entire nation trying to prove that they were; February 19, 2015 at 12:44 PM
Lance the Intern said...: I wasn't harassed by anyone during the Duke LAX case.

Therefore your statement is false.

And until you prove otherwise, in addition to being a liar, you are a rapist/murderer.; February 19, 2015 at 12:46 PM
Anonymous said...: seriously lance

that just about wraps ya up doesn't it

cases solved ... you can go find your distractions elsewhere now ... bye; February 19, 2015 at 12:51 PM
kenhyderal said...: Lance said: " How many times do you have to be told that North Carolina law does not permit the release of a discovery file?"........Investigative reporter and author William Cohan has filed a lawsuit trying to obtain the underlying documents for the report from Cooper’s office. Let's see if the withholding of this information from the public will stand up.; February 19, 2015 at 1:55 PM
kenhyderal said...: Anonymous said: "Someone let me know when Kenny or Sid says anything new and/or unpredictable. Until then, I'm done - this blog went from being a joke and source of some distraction to a pathetic delving into the mind of clearly mentally ill and sick individuals (Sid, Kenny, Tin Foil)..........What is pathetic is you "delving" into the minds of others here and remotely making psychiatric diagnoses, based on your superficial impressions of them. If you have qualifications, this is especially so. If you are unqualified, you are way over your head; February 19, 2015 at 2:11 PM
Lance the Intern said...: "Investigative reporter and author William Cohan has filed a lawsuit trying to obtain the underlying documents for the report from Cooper’s office..."

Dude -- Did you read the sentence from the N&O article after this one you just stole? You know, the one that reads "Under North Carolina state law, criminal investigative records are not public."?

Cohan filed his lawsuit before March 28 2014, and here we are a almost a year later. Are you aware of the current status of this lawsuit?; February 19, 2015 at 2:18 PM
Fake Kenhyderal said...: In a HuffPo interview from June 2014, Cohan stated "The State AG won’t open his investigatory files. I have sued in North Carolina to force him to open those files. I’m sure I’ll lose, and he won’t have to."; February 19, 2015 at 2:24 PM
guiowen said...: Kenhyderal,
Stop telling us all about "investigative reporter" Cohan. So far as I can see Cohan has some sort of grudge against the lacrosse players (maybe one of the stole his girl friend while he was a student at Duke). He has come up with nothing new except some wild speculations from Nifong and some wild stories from Crystal. No one familiar with the case believes him. As for his lawsuit --- I doubt he'll get the AG's office to break the law for him.; February 19, 2015 at 2:35 PM
Anonymous said...: you mean noone from the durham-in-wonderland blog groupies openly admits to believing what was written in the book after KC spent months tearing it apart; February 19, 2015 at 3:39 PM
guiowen said...: And an excellent job KC did tearing it apart.; February 19, 2015 at 3:51 PM
Anonymous said...: rather overdone if ya ask me

how many 1 ratings did ya'll finally end up posting on that book selling site - ya'll certainly outdid yourselves there; February 19, 2015 at 3:57 PM
guiowen said...: So tell us what it is that you did believe.; February 19, 2015 at 4:19 PM
John D. Smith said...: Lance,

You overstate @11:19's guilt. All you can say is that there is no proof he is not guilty of rape and murder. Similarly, there is no proof he is not guilty of being a pedophile, slave owner, drug dealer and terrorist. Indeed, there is no proof that Sidney, Kenny and @11:19 are not the mystery rapists Kenny discusses.

Anonymous @11:19,

Everyone must accept his conclusions without any facts, evidence nor proof.

This statement is false. I ask that you correct it.

No one imposes this requirement. There is substantial evidence made public prior to the release of the AG's report and substantial additional evidence made public after its release to support that conclusion. Nifong subsequently admitted there is no credible evidence to support the charges.

The AG's conclusion confirmed the conclusion reached earlier by observers who had followed the case and analyzed the evidence. No informed person takes the AG's conclusion on blind faith.

John D. Smith
New York, NY; February 19, 2015 at 4:59 PM
John D. Smith said...: Kenny,

I share your wish that Cooper had released critical evidence at the time he released his report.

I believe that Copper and the special prosecutors concluded that the evidence that supported the conclusion that the defendants were "innocent" of the charges they faced was so compelling that all honest, unbiased and reasonably intelligent and informed observers would reach the same conclusion. Indeed, most honest, unbiased and reasonably intelligent and informed observers had previously reached that conclusion based on the wealth of evidence that had already been made public. Based on this expectation, the summary provided was sufficient to confirm that conclusion.

I believe Cooper underestimated the number of other observers, such as you and Sidney, who cling to alternative conclusions driven largely by innuendo. I expect that no amount of evidence would be sufficient to convince those clinkers like yourself of "innocence."

John D. Smith
New York, NY; February 19, 2015 at 5:20 PM
kenhyderal said...: Lance said: "Dude -- Did you read the sentence from the N&O article after this one you just stole? You know, the one that reads "Under North Carolina state law, criminal investigative records are not public."? Cohan filed his lawsuit before March 28 2014, and here we are a almost a year later. Are you aware of the current status of this lawsuit?"............. No I am not. Perhaps you, or one of the other legal eagles here can find and quote the applicable North Carolina statute that governs this. I have not been able to. Selective details were found in the summary which I assume in some way do not violate the statute. The question that I have is, if not for the statute, would AG Cooper be willing to release this information and is he claiming he would but is prohibited from doing so by this law. He also refused an interview with William Cohan. The perception out there is that his pronouncement of innocence might not be supported by the investigation he conducted.; February 19, 2015 at 8:19 PM
Anonymous said...: kenny said:

"The perception out there is that his pronouncement of innocence might not be supported by the investigation he conducted."

The perception out there is that the lacrosse players were innocent and Mangum lied about being raped. That's what the evidence demonstrated and that is what the Attorney General concluded. It is why the players were awarded millions in damages.; February 19, 2015 at 9:03 PM
Anonymous said...: So the duke people get charged with rape and pedophilia, and a murder by malpractice is deemed suspicious, not to mention cop killings, and all the malpractice that kills people, the name of their medical practice labels them as drug dealers, there are certainly proud former slave owners in its history and on its rosters, and the terrorist thing ... many wonder about them after they tried to play the muslim prayer over a loud speaker in their esteemed christian chapel tower when they have a veteran's hospital located right across the street from their hospital, although for others it is simply more icing on the cake ... and then you sit there and project those crimes unto innocent bystanders shaking their heads at what duke has become and what it does.

Why does duke tend to blame others more than it blames itself for its own problems? You would think that they would be more intelligent than that, and since they also deem to be leaders in their fields of expertises, politics, finance, education, health and social engineering, its not really like any bystander nor inconsequential nonduke person is making them do anything they don't hold full responsibility for. So what it is then?; February 20, 2015 at 1:29 AM
Anonymous said...: "Collier sworn in as acting SBI director"

" ... The SBI had been part of the state Attorney General's Office, but as part of the new budget bill McCrory signed into law last week, it's become what's described as an independent agency within the Department of Public Safety, which answers to the governor."

"Acting North Carolina SBI Director Collier nominated to full term"

"... The governor picked Collier last August when the legislature shifted the SBI from under Attorney General Roy Cooper to under a McCrory Cabinet-level agency."

abc11.com; February 20, 2015 at 3:30 AM
Fake Kenhyderal said...: Kenny -- A 2 minute google search would lead you to NCGS 132.

The question that I have is, why were you not willing to search for this information?; February 20, 2015 at 11:36 AM
kenhyderal said...: Thanks for the link. This statute covers a variety of scenarios. I will have to look at the relevant sub-sections. Since you are such an adept google user perhaps you can also answer the question about the status of William Cohan's suit under the freedom of information act to see the details, deemed confidential by the statute, of AG Cooper's Investigative Report; February 20, 2015 at 1:36 PM
Fake Kenhyderal said...: Sorry, Kenny -- I've done enough of your work for you today.

Why don't you contact Mr. Cohan?; February 20, 2015 at 2:01 PM
kenhyderal supporter said...: Stop disrespecting kenhyderal you troll.; February 20, 2015 at 7:24 PM
Fake Kenhyderal Supporte said...: Stop disrespecting Fake Kenhyderal you troll.; February 21, 2015 at 3:10 PM

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Sunday, February 8, 2015

Was Reginald Daye's death a murder or an accident?

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